Minnesota Oli
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Posts posted by Minnesota Oli
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28 minutes ago, ChrisMI said:
From casually reading I think you can just use the heat portion of the current thermostat. I’ll be looking to do the same thing in 6 months or so. Current thinking is trying out the 9.5k unit and see how it will cool an elite II.
The control board for the thermostat is mounted on the AC unit. So when you set thermostat to heat it sends a signal to the control board that is mounted on the AC which then sends a signal to the furnace control board which then initiates the start up of the furnace. The work around I mentioned earlier in this post is a way you can make this work without having to pull more wires.
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3 hours ago, Spike said:
Minnesota Oli, I am just about completely sold on replacing my Dometic AC with the Houghton for the advantages you list--and more.
Nonetheless, as I have done some online investigation of the Houghton, it seems that, unlike the Dometic system that came with our 2017 Oliver, one cannot control the furnace with the Houghton remote. Did you purchase and use a separate remote to be able to control the furnace in your Oliver? If so, what product did you purchase, and what further modifications, if any, were needed to allow it to function?
This is the RecPro air conditioner (apparently manufactured by Houghton) that I am considering purchasing:
Minnesota Oli
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Here's a paragraph from Got Earplugs by katanapilot from My version of the Houghton AC install posted May 27.
As a sidenote halfway through the install I thought of a different way of doing the wiring for the thermostat. If a person replaced the LCD thermostat with a older manual style you could do away with the LCD relay board. If you look at the first picture that shows a group of wires that are in a black sheath, these are the control side of the wiring for the AC. In that group of wires there are two blue wires one with a white stripe. The one with the white stripe is hot 12 volts DC and the solid blue is the wire that goes to the furnace relay board. So re-allocate the existing thermostat wires by doubling them up ,two of them hooked to the solid blue and the other two hook to the blue with the white stripe. Then at the wall hook the two thermostat wires that are hooked to blue with white stripe to the power in on the new manual thermostat and the other two to the power out. The reason I would double them up is because of they're small gauge. This would do away with having to pull wires and using the LCD relay board. Also save you having to toggle through the unusable modes (heat strip, cool) on the LCD thermostat to get to the furnace mode.
By re-allocate the existing thermostat wires and doubling them up ,two of them hooked to the solid blue and the other two hook to the blue with the white stripe. Now you are able to utilize wires that are already there saving you having to run new ones. Simply switch out the thermostat with one that does not need a control board.
Paul
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I have a 2019 Oliver #475 and there was this spot open to use for mounting the monitor. I admit that the app for the phone is much more user-friendly but for a quick look or for some reason your phone is not working or available I still would not want to be without the monitor. The shunt for the monitor is located in the battery compartment so the area I picked for mounting the monitor is directly above it, although it was challenging to connecting the wire between the shunt and the monitor.
Looking into the pantry door, the inside corner to the front of the trailer is where you will drill down through three layers of fiberglass, pantry inner shell, pantry outer shell, and base cabinet. Then drill a hole through the side of pantry inner shell. Now use the drill to cut a trough between the two holes. The drill needs to be sized to allow the plastic terminal on the end of the cable to pass through the hole.
Now using a fish tape pull the cable up from basement into the pantry. Then from the access hatch on the top of the pantry side wall feed the fish tape down between the walls to the hole you drilled in the side of the inner pantry shell. Now you can pull the cable the rest of the way up to where the monitor will be mounted.
You will notice that the back side of the hole for the monitor is in a area that transitions to a different wall thickness in the middle of the hole so I used the threaded ring on the back in combination with the front mount that is provided with the monitor.
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- This is how I ran the AC with the 2000 watt inverter. I added anther transfer switch to operate the AC circuit on my 2019 built Oliver.
Besides the huge improvement in the sound level there is also another area where it surpasses the Dometic AC that I had replaced. The Houghton with the compressor running draws 10 amps while the Dometic was pulling 16 amps. So I decided to install a second transfer switch for the air conditioner to test it running off the batteries.
It was 11 o'clock in the morning on a cloudless sunny day the temperature was 88 degrees. I had my batteries 400 Ah fully charged with 340 watts on the roof and 230 watts remote ready to feed it. I set the thermostat at 70 degrees and turned on the AC. Once it brought the temperature down to 70 I noticed it was cycling four minutes on with the compressor and four minutes off. I left it running until about 5 o'clock and was surprised to see that the batteries were at 97 percent. So I was happy with those results but time will tell if that is the norm.
I put the picture in to also show it's nice low profile.
Paul
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Yes this was done on a knee mill that I retrofitted with a 2 axis cnc kit. Now this is very helpful for making these pieces for this project but since there are only two pieces and the winter is long there is no reason why they could not be fabricated with hand tools similar to making the pieces out of wood. By this I mean drill press, band saw, drum sander, and the like.
I'm very happy with the outcome of the project. Earlier this year I took Oliver into places that I probably shouldn't have, another words I was a little concerned at the time but afterwards all came out fine.Places like Rabbit Valley, Colorado and Moab, Utah, I'm talking a lot of deep ruts in the roadway and lots of rocks and the mudflaps survived with no issues. They do a great job of protecting the complete under side of the trailer beyond the wheel wells.
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Posted February 1 (edited)https://www.bluesea.com/products/2718/MaxiBus_Insulating_Cover_for_PN_2105_and_2126https://www.bluesea.com/products/2126/MaxiBus_250A_BusBar_-_Six_5_16in-18_Studshttps://www.amazon.com/Battery-Spartan-Power-Negative-Terminals/dp/B07MXQSNHR/ref=sr_1_5?dchild=1&hvadid=77859219137661&hvbmt=bb&hvdev=c&hvqmt=b&keywords=spartan%2Bcable&qid=1612200841&sr=8-5&tag=mh0b-20&th=1
On 1/28/2021 at 12:34 PM, BackofBeyond said:Yep - or at a minimum - design sheet, specs, etc.
A really nice job. One I will have in mind in a few years.
RB
Well I want to try to answer to this request. Its a project that requires you to cover a lot of ground so I decided to break it down to individual aspect of the project.
So I am standing at the side of the Oliver looking at the open battery compartment. I see this maze of cables and I am thinking of a discussion on the Oliver Forum. It was suggesting that there could be a improvement to this maze of cables by installing bus bars, one positive and one negative inside the basement of the Oliver. This would allow the cables from the various components such as Zamp Solar Controller, Side wall solar Port, Progressive Dynamics Power Center, and the chassis ground to be routed to the relevant bus bar. With that done it would only leave the positive and the negative 4/0 cables leading to to the battery compartment from each perspective bus bar. With that said the only other cables that my set up has is the one that leads from the Victron BMV-712 battery monitor to the remote display. I also have a now unused wire that was for the temperature probe that was hook up to the Zamp solar controller. The service person at Battle Born advised to disconnect this at the Zamp solar controller, I did leave the unhooked wire in place for possible future use.
I then went inside to determine the placement of the bus bars considering the number and lengths of cables that need to be relocated and how I was going to attach them in the Oliver basement. I was looking at the positive 4/0 cable coming in to the basement from the battery compartment then going to the main fuse block and then continuing on to the inverter. That is when I thought about swapping out the fuse block with the positive bus bar sense the 4/0 cable is already run and no need to make up positive 4/0 cables. It also had a mounting block already in place. This meant I could move the main fuse out to the battery compartment next to the positive battery post to better protect the wiring. This was another topic I remember following on the Oliver Forum, so much information to be had.
I looked at how the various cables were run into both sides of the battery compartment and they had positive on one side and negative on the other. So it made sense with the wire lengths the way they were to try to find a spot to mount the negative bus bar in the compartment under the street side bed.
I started looking for a place or a way to do it with out having to glue a block to the fiberglass. I noticed two 1/2" bolts that were used to mount the street side stabilizer to the frame. I used a 1/4" aluminum flat that was 6" X 14" long. I then drilled holes to match the stabilizer mount. I then had to put a slight bend about 5" from the end so the plate would run parallel to the wheel well. That is where I mounted the negative bus bar. When I pulled the cables back out of the battery compartment I was able to do it with out removing the terminal ends. Some I had to bend slightly to get them through the cable glands, but this saved me from having to mess around with installing new ones. All the wires turned out to be the right length except the positive wire from the remote solar port. I was able to shorten that wire where there was a inline fuse and add a ring terminal. The negative 4/0 cable that went from the battery to the inverter was then rerouted to the negative bus bar. The only cable I had to buy was a three foot 4/0 to go from the negative bus bar to the inverter.
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There's probably a lot more that comes in to play when components are chosen for the Oliver, my 2019 has multiple Dometic products so I'm sure the more components the better the over all price point.
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I just want to mention that earlier this year in April I spent ten days in Colorado and Utah with the Oliver with out shore power. The Oliver had 340 watts on the roof and Zamp 30 amp charge controller. The only up grade was four 100 ah Battle Born batteries and Victron battery monitor. We used the furnace every night, inverter for coffee maker every morning and microwave a few times to thaw food. Plus lights, water pump, fan, music. I brought alone a generator but never needed it. We always had batteries top off with the morning sun. This was a big improvement over my previous experience with the AGM batteries.
At this point I am happy that I kept my 2000 watt Inverter, it handles everything just fine including the new Houghton AC with out any of the new inverter charger issues. I recently up graded my roof mounted solar only because I live in MN and can not expect to harvest as much energy as Colorado or Utah. I do think simpler is better, like the Battle Born batteries are easy to use when coupled with Victron battery monitor and a cut off switch, which make it easy to care for off season. So eventually they will work the kinks out but simpler is better.
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35 minutes ago, SeaDawg said:
I don't think that's a "cheap out." I think it's more an easier option for most owners. Zamp is in no way "cheap" equipment. It's solid, well tested, well received, usa based, and an integral part of the Oliver solar package for a long time.
Is it appropriate or best for lifepo4 batteries? No, imo, not really. I suspect that will change, in the future. In the meantime, if I were buying a lithium option, I'd ask for an mppt controller, and if turned down, I'd swap it out. The more people who ask, the greater likelihood of change. Heck, maybe zamp will even come out with an mppt someday soon.
A solid industry tested mppt controller would be a great addition to the system, imo . We have victron on the boat, blue sky in our trailer, and lithium in neither (yet.) Both solar controllers are capable of working with lithium. We may, or may not, change up to lifepo4 in the future. I'm personally not sold, yet, on the expense or necessity, for our needs.
But, truth is, most relatively small pv systems (like what fits on the Oliie rooftop) could not fully recharge the big lithium batteries being sold today, on a regular basis, if drawn down to zero. The math doesn't support it. So, reliable, proven easy to use Zamp is not such a bad choice, either.
I would agree with SeaDawg, I have recently completed a up grade to roof mounted panels and have had talked to Zamp about recommendations for charge controller for the rated watts of my solar array. They are very helpful and easy to talk to and for my size of system they recommend a mppt charge controller, they said they currently do not have one to offer to me but that in the future they will have one. It was in the process of being developed, I did purchase there panels for my project, I do think they make a quality product and I like the made in USA.
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Life has a way of getting in the way of working on your projects but I'm getting closer to the finish.
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Maybe or maybe not.
I will be posting about the project under Ollie Modifications when complete.
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40 minutes ago, Brian Z said:
It looks like a terrific solution. You do great work. I will definitely take a closer look. Thanks, I am grateful for you sharing the design and information.
I see that the link is not working so I'll try again.
https://olivertraveltrailers.com/forums/topic/4956-lithium-battery-upgrade/
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You can use cables or what I used was buss bars and locked the four batteries together with a piece of material called star board which I machined to interlock the batteries together. I used that to mount the main fuse, the disconnect switch and the Victron battery monitor. Here is a link to the project.
http:// Home Oliver Campers Ollie Modifications Lithium Battery Upgrade
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Yes they fit very nicely.
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This is what I used this space for.
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Here's a paragraph from Got Earplugs by katanapilot from My version of the Houghton AC install posted May 27.
As a sidenote halfway through the install I thought of a different way of doing the wiring for the thermostat. If a person replaced the LCD thermostat with a older manual style you could do away with the LCD relay board. If you look at the first picture that shows a group of wires that are in a black sheath, these are the control side of the wiring for the AC. In that group of wires there are two blue wires one with a white stripe. The one with the white stripe is hot 12 volts DC and the solid blue is the wire that goes to the furnace relay board. So re-allocate the existing thermostat wires by doubling them up ,two of them hooked to the solid blue and the other two hook to the blue with the white stripe. Then at the wall hook the two thermostat wires that are hooked to blue with white stripe to the power in on the new manual thermostat and the other two to the power out. The reason I would double them up is because of they're small gauge. This would do away with having to pull wires and using the LCD relay board. Also save you having to toggle through the unusable modes (heat strip, cool) on the LCD thermostat to get to the furnace mode.
By re-allocate the existing thermostat wires and doubling them up ,two of them hooked to the solid blue and the other two hook to the blue with the white stripe. Now you are able to utilize wires that are already there saving you having to run new ones. Simply switch out the thermostat with one that does not need a control board.
Paul
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20 minutes ago, wolfdds said:
@Minnesota OliWho did you purchase your Houghton from?
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I would take a look under curb side bed and make sure the heating ducts are still attached to the furnace.
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8 hours ago, ChrisMI said:
It looks like the Houghton models spec out at 1370w and 1550w for the 9.5 and 13.5. The dometic 11k list out at 1382w. @Minnesota Oli was the amp draw on the low setting and did you replace a 13.5 or 11k unit?
My old AC was 13.5 Dometic the new is Houghton 13.5 I had the fan on auto and the compressor was running and it was show 10 amp draw.
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9 hours ago, 2008RN said:
Minnesota Oli:
1. Did you leave the ends of the flexible heating pipe open?
2. Was the only other opening the hole in the straight pipe, or did you poke any holes in the heating pipe around where the check valve are at?
3. Where did you source the mounting bracket holding the straight tube below the battery compartment?
Yes I left the ends open. I added two additional runs to the furnace. One was a 2 inch which ran literally on top of the water pipes that run across the back of the trailer and ended pointing into the trough where the city water and freshwater and their check valves are located. Because of that area being covered by the floor of the storage area it forms a tunnel which the other end comes out right below the outdoor shower valve, so the heated air flows by all the plumbing in the tunnel and rises to warm the whole area around the outside shower valve. The other run was a 4 inch because it was a longer run, it was directed to go by the outdoor shower plumbing on its way past the battery compartment. That was the only place in the duct where I put a hole for flooding heat under the battery compartment. The 4 inch continued on towards the front of the trailer until the foot well of the dinette where it needed to be reduced to fit into the small trough so it could continue its way to the front to flood the area around the bathroom plumbing. When reducing to two inch there was room to add two more pipes to flood the area on ether side of the black water drain pipe which also formed a tunnel under the dinette foot well. This brought additional warm air to the front end of the trailer. My thought was to rely on heat radiating from the duct work to help keep the plumbing from freezing, but also flooding key areas.This is mimicking what the factory did on the curbside but neglected on the street side. One other positive side effect of adding the two extra heat runs was that the furnace now runs quieter,less forced air noise.
The question about the mounting bracket, this is something that I fabricated in my shop.
Your question about maybe less condensation on the walls, all I can say is overall the trailer was way more comfortable the bathroom was warmer and while sleeping in the street side bed there was not that chilly wall to contend with.
I highly recommend that Oliver owners should do this modification to the heating system, it's not that complicated pretty simple and straightforward with great results. It was enough to make the four season Oliver truly four season.
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9 minutes ago, SeaDawg said:
Looks great, with your low profile fan, too.
I'm curious about the relatively short cycles. We haven't experienced this, but we have a smaller unit, and smaller trailer.
I'd like to see a wider range in temp with the thermostat setup. We haven't been able to use our Houghton, much.
Yes I was thinking about the short cycles also and a possible explanation would be the trailer internal temperature had not stabilized yet since I only stayed long enough for it to drop to temp set on thermostat. I did stop in to check the batteries couple times during the 6 hour test but neglected to check cycle time. I have also not used it much ether.
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Besides the huge improvement in the sound level there is also another area where it surpasses the Dometic AC that I had replaced. The Houghton with the compressor running draws 10 amps while the Dometic was pulling 16 amps. So I decided to install a second transfer switch for the air conditioner to test it running off the batteries.
It was 11 o'clock in the morning on a cloudless sunny day the temperature was 88 degrees. I had my batteries 400 Ah fully charged with 340 watts on the roof and 230 watts remote ready to feed it. I set the thermostat at 70 degrees and turned on the AC. Once it brought the temperature down to 70 I noticed it was cycling four minutes on with the compressor and four minutes off. I left it running until about 5 o'clock and was surprised to see that the batteries were at 97 percent. So I was happy with those results but time will tell if that is the norm.
I put the picture in to also show it's nice low profile.
Paul
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15 hours ago, mossemi said:
Nicely done but I have to ask, what’s the coiled duct work for? Is that heat for camping up north?
Mossey
Thanks. I try to share some of my projects to give back to the Oliver forum for all the great info and ideas I have gleaned from it.
To answer your question yes that is part of an upgrade I did to the heating system. Last winter here in Minnesota I was able to test my heating modification in sub zero temperatures. I loaded the Oliver with water and with no added insulation I spent 2 1/2 days in temperatures reaching negative 12 below zero. This was done using only battery and available solar to power the trailer. If interested check out Breaking Subzero | Oliver Furnace Mod under Ollie Modifications.
Thanks Paul
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We prefer to bring our water from home which is filtered through ceramic filter. We use 6 gallon jugs to bring a supply of water with and then have smaller glass containers for our daily use, one is kept in the refrigerator for drinking water the other on the table for coffee or cooking. So to free up some space in the closet I decided to utilize the space under the dinette seating. To be able to accommodate two jugs I would drop the first one in the opening and slide it towards the foot well and then have the room in the opening to drop in the second one in. To accomplish this I had to remove the obstacle which was a receptacle box for the ground fault outlet. I relocated it to the opposite side on the same wall. By the way this was the first time that I cut any fiberglass on my trailer. It wasn't as bad as I thought it would be. I then made a aluminum backer plate so I could use a blank cover on the front to fill the hole that was left.
My next concern was to protect the insulation on the floor of the compartment, so I decided to fit a piece of quarter inch plexiglass that I had on hand
The last step of the project was to make a bookend to stop the water jugs from sliding forward. Here I used a short piece of 3/4" foam water pipe insulation and added some pieces of adhesive backed one inch foam to form the back stop, this is slipped over the black tank back flush pipe and butts up against the black water tank.
There was one other obstacle, there were a series of wiring harnesses that came up out of the trough and were tethered with tie straps and screwed to the floor and then went off to various locations I had to undo the tie straps and gather enough slack to move the harnesses back far enough to clear the area where the plexiglass was laid.
What am I going to do with all the extra space in the closet?
Paul
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Bilge Heater.
in General Discussion
Posted
Kirk
I will give you another option to consider, the method I used was to add two additional heat runs from the furnace with out cutting holes or adding fans. I believe the furnace also runs a little quieter because the fan is not fighting to push air through only two heat ducts. I tested this modification in subzero weather for 2 1/2 days with full water tank and water pump on. The trailer temperature was more balanced with the bathroom staying cozy warm and the street side wall along the bed was not chilly. The coolest area in the Oliver was the closet.
Here is a link to Breaking Subzero Oliver Furnace Mod
Paul