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Hitch Questions


donthompson

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Brakes for 7 pin connectors use a common wire (blue) for left and right brakes (returned through ground). It would be interesting to see if an 8th wire for independent control of the brakes to staighten the trailer out in a sway situation would be much better than simultaneously applying brakes on both sides.

 

I'm convinced that a straight pull to the rear with both brakes equally applied is the best approach.  Whenever one brake is applied it tends to steer the trailer and pull the rear of the truck toward that brake.  So the back of the truck would be pulled  left and right as each brake was applied and let go.  This is practiacally the same thing that is happening during a sway event.

 

With both brakes applied evenly and at the same time a straight rearward pull is applied and the trailer stops swaying.  It's also easier to wire because you don't have to wire each brake separately.

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John


"I only exaggerate enough to compensate for being taken with a grain of salt."


LE2 #92 (sold),   Black Series HQ19   

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Good input Rob. My Avalanche must have weaker springs than your F150 because it drops about two inches when I hitch up. The WDH corrects this and that is the main reason I continue using it. I am going to look into some helper springs because I sure would rather not go through the extra step of hooking up the Anderson.

Perhaps, but it is worth noting my F150 also drops. Never measured it but once I am hitched up the truck sits visually level and without hitching the F150 has a noticeable rear end rise as do all trucks. This is most likely from the design figuring the vast majority of trucks do get used for some towing. However this may or may not apply to your Avalanche.

 

We’ve all seen trailers that either point noise down or up due to incorrect hitching setups. We did make some changes however at delivery day in order to accomplish this by simply reversing my existing hitch upside down and flipping the ball at the hitch, otherwise the Oliver would have been very nose down.

 

Don you might also want to check in with the Fiberglass RV forums if you haven’t already. Lately there has been a lively discussion regarding tow vehicles WDH hitches and as you might guess opinions are all over the place. I suspect your Taureg will do well and w/o a WDH.

 

The Fiberglass RV Forums is all over the place on WDH's, this is probably because more on that forum are pulling smaller/lighter trailers and with tow vehicles built much the same way. Thus you end up with combinations of mixed thought on what works for each.

 

trainman

2019 RAM 1500, 5.7 Hemi, 4X4, Crew Cab, 5'7" bed, Towing Package, 3.92 Gears.

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My 2 cents: The Tundra may or may not be OK without the Anderson, depending on the Elite II weight, but my suspicion is that it will be marginal at best, and over bad roads you will be swearing a lot. The bouncing will really stress the rear axle and shocks, and the passengers. Other than the hitch issue, it will do a good job towing, better than my Land Cruiser, since it has a lower axle ratio (4.10 vs 3.9). The engine is a real beast but you have to work it hard in the high 12% mountain grades - rev it to 4000 or higher and it will be fine.

 

If you want worry free towing, get a 3/4 ton diesel truck, use a dead weight hitch and don't look back. It's a much better choice.

 

I always ask this question when folks want a recommendation like this: WHERE DO YOU PLAN TO TOW? It is a very important factor that you need to consider. Florida vs Colorado is a huge difference.

 

John Davies

 

Spokane WA

 

 

SOLD 07/23 "Mouse":  2017 Legacy Elite II Two Beds, Hull Number 218, See my HOW TO threads: https://olivertraveltrailers.com/topic/john-e-davies-how-to-threads-and-tech-articles-links/

Tow Vehicle: 2013 Land Cruiser 200, 32” LT tires, airbags, Safari snorkel, Maggiolina Grand Tour 360 Carbon RTT.

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The Tundra may or may not be OK without the Anderson, depending on the Elite II weight, but my suspicion is that it will be marginal at best, and over bad roads you will be swearing a lot.

 

All I can say about this is that we have towed thousands of miles now with our 2013 5.7 4X4 Tundra without the Andersen, and without swearing (at least about the truck, trailer, or hitch). I did install the Hayes Sway Master, not because we had any issue with sway but as an additional safety measure. (It engaged once when I had to swerve to avoid hitting a teenager swerving into my lane while texting, and I was glad it did.)

 

In addition to feeling stable, as far as sway is concerned, the Tundra always feels up to the task power-wise: I've been able to accelerate quickly when needed, pulled Ollie up some steep, unpaved hills using the 4x4 function, etc. When people ask how our Oliver tows, I say "Like a dream." Compared to other RV rigs out there, I feel like we are the luxury sports-car rig on the road. I haven't towed with anything else, so I can't compare towing experiences, but I certainly don't feel that the Tundra's capabilities are "marginal."

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Onward through the Fog!


EarthPicks of Cochise County


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As some additional food for thought, I just had my LE2 weighed.  Oliver shows a weight on their site of approximately 4,600 lbs.  Mine, with a full fresh water tank, empty grey and black tanks, weighs 5,600 lbs.  We do not have an excessive amount of gear, just a well stocked pantry, food in the fridge, some bottled water, normal amount of clothes, cooking utensils, blankets, etc.  That weight did not include the slinky, fresh water hose, tools or shore tie power cord.  We have the 30 lb propane tanks. One full and one about 1/2.  No Anderson hitch.

 

I was surprised at the weight.

 

I'm also carrying about 1,000 lbs of gear and passengers in the truck.  That is more than it has to be, but not really excessive.  Four chairs, floor mats, small folding aluminum table, wheel chocks, leveling jack stands and blocks, extra fuel, jumper cables, inverter and small compressor, bicycles, propane fire pit with 30' of hose, case of drinking water, bucket and bag of tools, small aluminum floor jack and various spare parts and equipment.  This trip I had no outdoor stove, outdoor cooking gear or firewood which could easily add another 100 lbs. and I only had about a half tank of fuel.

 

So by the time you figure a 5600 lb trailer, that would be more with water in the holding tanks, 1,000 to 1,300 lbs of gear, passengers, etc, you're looking at 6,600 to 6,900 lbs.  I need a truck that can easily handle a 5,600 lb trailer and a GCVWR that includes the truck and 6,900 lbs.

 

My truck is a Ram 3500 diesel.  I weighed it when I weighed the trailer.   It has a weight of 9,000 lbs all loaded and ready to go, including passengers.  It's rated for 11,500 GVWR.  The truck and trailer combined is rated for 17,380 lbs total and mine came out at 14,600.

 

This seems like a lot of weight, but the margin of safety is comforting and noticeable as the truck feels planted all the time.  It also helps me appreciate the simplicity of the 13' Cassita that folks can tow with a small vehicle.  I didn't choose the Ram to match the Oliver, I already had it for other purposes, but it turns out to be a very good match except for it's rough ride.   The rough ride shows up mainly on rocky roads, but highways are fine.  Washboard roads are a problem for the Oliver anyway and just as rough on the trailer as the Ram.

 

3/4 and 1 ton Rams have very capable brakes and diesels have engine brakes too.  So even though the truck seems like overkill, it has no trouble, ever, keeping the speed under control or stopping.  It also makes towing a lot less stressful to be able to easily pass slower vehicles on the steepest of highway grades.

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John


"I only exaggerate enough to compensate for being taken with a grain of salt."


LE2 #92 (sold),   Black Series HQ19   

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True, the Fiberglass RV Forums does have an active topic on WDH's, but as you read about them you will find it is mostly about small tow vehicles and trailers in the 13' to 17' range. This probably wouldn't give you too much info about pulling the Oliver or trailers of this size.  It can be pretty interesting reading on just how small of SUV they try to make fit there setup, I would say many are dangerous and I wouldn't recommend any of them. I know we all walk around the camping ground and wonder how some got here with there rig, I know I do.

 

 

 

trainman

2019 RAM 1500, 5.7 Hemi, 4X4, Crew Cab, 5'7" bed, Towing Package, 3.92 Gears.

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I know we all walk around the camping ground and wonder how some got here with there rig, I know I do.

 

trainman

 

Then while driving home I think one of them coming at us the other direction everytime I see a oncoming camper.

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Tom & Cheryl 

LE II #305

2018 GMC 2500HD SLT Duramax

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I know we all walk around the camping ground and wonder how some got here with there rig, I know I do.

 

trainman

Then while driving home I think one of them coming at us the other direction everytime I see a oncoming camper.

 

 

The ones that get my attention, on the road, are the gigantic 5th wheel trailers that simply dwarf the truck towing them.  They just seem wrong on so many levels, plus they are severely restricted in where they can camp.  Sheesh.  Camp?  Is that camping?  I noticed one at Bullard's Beach the other day that had a big screen TV outside.  It had it's own compartment that opened up somehow.  An outdoor theater.  The TV was blasting away and could be heard several sites away.    That trailer would be severely restricted at Yosemite and hard to pull in there in the first place.  It would not be allowed at Grand Canyon camp sites.   Is it better  to have a huge luxury apartment and outdoor theater, while on the road, or better to be able to visit some of the most incredible parks in the country?  Is it better to experience the Grand Canyon, for instance, or watch TV while somewhere else?

 

A friend of mine was camping and one of these big units came in.  It was too high to fit into the site, so the owner whipped out his handy chainsaw and began lopping limbs from the trees.  He actually had a chainsaw handy for this purpose, in a park!  Pretty soon an irate ranger showed up.

John


"I only exaggerate enough to compensate for being taken with a grain of salt."


LE2 #92 (sold),   Black Series HQ19   

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A friend of mine was camping and one of these big units came in. It was too high to fit into the site, so the owner whipped out his handy chainsaw and began lopping limbs from the trees. He actually had a chainsaw handy for this purpose, in a park! Pretty soon an irate ranger showed up.

 

 

We saw the same thing in Colorado last June. I could not belive the guy had a chain saw and got up on top of the camper and cut a limb off a tree. Must be a necessity 5th wheel people carry.

 

It's also scary to see them coming up behind you at 80 plus MPH and buzzing by on those 65 MPH tires. Twice recently after they have blown by we saw them a few miles later on the side of the road with a blow out. I feel like stopping and saying that's what you get for driving like a jerk.

ABNBNSPEALARCOCTDEFLGAIDILINIAKSKYLAMEMDMAMSMOMTNENHNMNYNCOHOKPARISCSDTNTXUTVTVAWVWYmed.jpg

 

Tom & Cheryl 

LE II #305

2018 GMC 2500HD SLT Duramax

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A friend of mine was camping and one of these big units came in. It was too high to fit into the site, so the owner whipped out his handy chainsaw and began lopping limbs from the trees. He actually had a chainsaw handy for this purpose, in a park! Pretty soon an irate ranger showed up.

We saw the same thing in Colorado last June. I could not belive the guy had a chain saw and got up on top of the camper and cut a limb off a tree. Must be a necessity 5th wheel people carry.

 

It’s also scary to see them coming up behind you at 80 plus MPH and buzzing by on those 65 MPH tires. Twice recently after they have blown by we saw them a few miles later on the side of the road with a blow out. I fell like stopping and saying that’s what you get for driving like a jerk.

 

 

I wonder if there is a psychological link between wanting the biggest trailer on the planet and being clueless about the ramifications of that decision?  Wanting to go "camping" but happy to cut the trees down to get in, or clueless about park rules or just totally lacking any respect.

 

Reminds me of the guy with the emormous motorhome in Yosemite who ran his generator all day, even though they were outside chatting.  Conveniently, for him, the exhaust vented on the side where we were.  Midday, he felt compelled to wander over to my site and mention that my truck was parked incorrectly.  Just a public service announcement, I guess.  Trying to give me a clue, or something.  What a jackass.

 

Next, we'll see some enterprising manufacturer offer a "Chainsaw Option".  Or an aftermarket company offer a "chainsaw kit" for problem trees.  We'll be reading Amazon reviews about the speed at which it gets the job done.  A blog will start up on how to avoid the rangers, or deal with the campers that had a branch land on their trailer, or just don't like the assault on the park.

 

I've been noticing that people with fiberglass trailers, in general, and Olivers, in particular, are nice and generous people that put real thought into what they do.   Folks I like to meet and get to know.   I never thought I'd be so interested in going to organized rallys, but now I get it.  The people are great to hang out with.  Fun, unpretentious and helpful.   We all have a somewhat common interest and like sharing the scene.

 

 

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John


"I only exaggerate enough to compensate for being taken with a grain of salt."


LE2 #92 (sold),   Black Series HQ19   

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I’ve been noticing that people with fiberglass trailers, in general, and Olivers, in particular, are nice and generous people that put real thought into what they do. Folks I like to meet and get to know. I never thought I’d be so interested in going to organized rallys, but now I get it. The people are great to hang out with. Fun, unpretentious and helpful. We all have a somewhat common interest and like sharing the scene.

 

John, I agree. Oliver folks and fiberglass folks in general are a nice group to be with. I’m always confused when someone in a huge 5th wheel pulls in, sets up and then never leaves their trailer. What’s the point? Mike

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Texas Hill Country | 2016 Elite II #135 | 2020 Ram 2500 6.7L

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Yep, this last trip we stayed in campgrounds much more often than normal, and we learned that the best neighbors were always fellow fiberglass owners.  In Glacier, we had set up on a spot without neighbors, but returned later to find we were surrounded by Casitas.  Probably the nicest group of people we've run across while camping.

 

For some reason Escape owners seem to keep off to themselves, but Casita and Scamp people seem to be not just invariably outgoing, but also people whom you don't mind hanging around with.

 

And yeah, those wheeled McMansions must be too nice to leave because you never see those people.  At Yellowstone, where the campsites are basically parking spaces, we felt like we were camping in an aluminum slot canyon.  At least they keep to themselves - just the mysterious glow from all the TVs inside.  I do wish the parks would put a major limit on those things.  Something in the neighborhood of 23'-6" is probably a good number.

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I do wish the parks would put a major limit on those things.  Something in the neighborhood of 23′-6″ is probably a good number.

 

 

LOL  That's funny.

 

At Grand Canyon, south rim, I was asked the length of my trailer and told 22' was the limit for the campsites.  Since he didn't clarify if that included the tongue or not, I told him mine was 20'  "Perfect, we can accommodate you".

 

At the Mobile Bay Ferry in Alabama, their website says 28' max (evidently not including the TV, although that is not said).  When we arrived, the guy said "today we are limiting trailers to 23' ".  Magically, ours was 23'  What a coincidence!

 

BTW, I'm interested in what campgrounds to visit in Yellowstone.  Any suggestions from anyone????????

John


"I only exaggerate enough to compensate for being taken with a grain of salt."


LE2 #92 (sold),   Black Series HQ19   

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I’m always confused when someone in a huge 5th wheel pulls in, sets up and then never leaves their trailer. What’s the point? Mike

Mike, try not to be so judgemental.

 

I hate those huge monsters but I often like to hang out inside my Ollie. I am not an especially social person, plus I have allergies, so when the pollen count is high, the skeeters are swarming, or the atmosphere is full of smoke particles, which means everywhere out west this summer, I tend to stay inside with my HEPA filter cleaning the air.

 

I stll enjoy the travel and the camping, I just don’t sit outside for hours. I do not watch TV tho, that addiction I simply cannot understand.

 

John Davies

 

Spokane WA

SOLD 07/23 "Mouse":  2017 Legacy Elite II Two Beds, Hull Number 218, See my HOW TO threads: https://olivertraveltrailers.com/topic/john-e-davies-how-to-threads-and-tech-articles-links/

Tow Vehicle: 2013 Land Cruiser 200, 32” LT tires, airbags, Safari snorkel, Maggiolina Grand Tour 360 Carbon RTT.

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John,

 

You got that right about the smoke!  Sheesh.

 

We left Bandon Oregon with it's cool ocean breezes, clear and beautiful.  The sea air reminding me of my time sailing.  Right away it was brown smoky air everywhere. Went to Lava Beds in NE Cal. and we were coughing all night.  Visibility was terrible.  We haven't been able to get out of it and now here in Northern Nevada, it looks like a rainy day.  Very dim sun, very short visibility.  Been this way for days.  Last night the moon was a dim yellow.

 

I'm beginning to get tired of this summer.

 

I really like to be outside.  Both at home and while camping.  Now, not so much.

John


"I only exaggerate enough to compensate for being taken with a grain of salt."


LE2 #92 (sold),   Black Series HQ19   

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I do wish the parks would put a major limit on those things. Something in the neighborhood of 23′-6″ is probably a good number.

LOL That’s funny.

 

At Grand Canyon, south rim, I was asked the length of my trailer and told 22′ was the limit for the campsites. Since he didn’t clarify if that included the tongue or not, I told him mine was 20′ “Perfect, we can accommodate you”.

 

At the Mobile Bay Ferry in Alabama, their website says 28′ max (evidently not including the TV, although that is not said). When we arrived, the guy said “today we are limiting trailers to 23′ “. Magically, ours was 23′ What a coincidence!

 

BTW, I’m interested in what campgrounds to visit in Yellowstone. Any suggestions from anyone????????

 

I use Airstream dimensions when it comes to size limits - if it works for them then I have no problem doing the same.  So our Ollie is always 18' when asked.  And really even that's generous.  In short campsites, we can park with the rear overhanging the grass so we probably only take up 16' or so.

 

We stayed at Fishing Bridge.  I wouldn't necessarily recommend it since it seems to be where all the big rigs go.  But we really didn't mind since we were out at dawn and back in after dark.  If you're going during the high season then I'd just recommend staying close to where you want to spend most of your time.  Mid-May when we were there was busy but when we went back through in June traffic was a nightmare.  I'd have gone insane if we were trying to see the park then.

 

If you want to boondock, Slough Creek in Lamar valley seemed out of the way and in the midst of a ton of wildlife, including the Slough Creek wolf pack who have their den on the hillside across the creek.  No reservations there though so it might be hard to get a spot.

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BTW, I’m interested in what campgrounds to visit in Yellowstone. Any suggestions from anyone????????

Both Yellerstone and Tetons, plus the nearby highways and towns are absolutely swarming with visitors, like a kicked anthill. My advice is to wait until September, when all the little people are back in school and hopefully the air quality has improved. For a boondocking spot good for several nights or longer, try this....

 

http://olivertraveltrailers.com/topic/super-boondocking-spot-near-cody-wy/

 

On the ID/WY border south of Tetons, Palisades Reservoir is simply lovely with many possible camping locations.

 

https://www.fs.usda.gov/recarea/ctnf/recarea/?recid=54449

 

You don’t have to actually go into the parks for great scenery, and the crowds are gone.

 

John Davies

 

Spokane WA

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SOLD 07/23 "Mouse":  2017 Legacy Elite II Two Beds, Hull Number 218, See my HOW TO threads: https://olivertraveltrailers.com/topic/john-e-davies-how-to-threads-and-tech-articles-links/

Tow Vehicle: 2013 Land Cruiser 200, 32” LT tires, airbags, Safari snorkel, Maggiolina Grand Tour 360 Carbon RTT.

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I saw a hitch on a truck the other day made by B & W (tow and stow). When I got home, I researched it and liked what I read. It has multiple adjustments. I found out that this hitch is sold at 5 different dealership within a 50 mile radius of where I live. Does anyone use this hitch?

 

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While I don't have one, it seems like it should be a good one, looking at etrailer it is rated 5 stars with more than 500 reviews. My only opinion is that, where I only tow one trailer, a multi ball hitch is just more mass and weight, that I don't need

Randy


One Life Live It Enjoyably


2017 F350 6.7L SRW CC LB


2015 Oliver Elite II Hull #69

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That hitch seems good if you need to change the ball height frequently.  But if not, I wouldn't get one.  It's expensive and complicated and will definitely rattle.

 

I selected a drop height that works with my rig with Ollie attached and ready to go.  A good stinger with a three inch drop costs about 50 bucks and is a simple one piece design.

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John


"I only exaggerate enough to compensate for being taken with a grain of salt."


LE2 #92 (sold),   Black Series HQ19   

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