Maximizing the Oliver's battery capacity...

[herm]

Doug, please check your 'private message' inbox.

[dougi]

Herm, thanks for the PM.

[jam49]

Hello to all,

I am on the verge of ordering for pickup in December. That's the only time I have enough days off from work to go to Tennessee from Taylor, Texas. Doug, My husband and I were over your way Saturday. We took some cows to the auction. Love the drive over there. The forum topics have been terrific in helping me decide what options are the best for me. I have spoken to Robert on the phone several times and thru email. He truly is a very nice person to work with. I am working with him to finalize my order. Thanks for all the dialog about batteries, and gas hoses, and outlets and ............

It has helped me sort out what options are best for our Ollie.

[jam49]

I forgot to ask. Can deep cycle marine batteries be used interchangeably with Oliver?

[dougi]

There are two issues here, jam49.

 

The first is battery size. Some deep cycle marine batteries are too large to fit the battery tray and/or compartment. The most common size problem is battery height. Many batteries are too tall to fit this compartment and still have room at the top for cables and connections. Others may be too long or wide to fit the tray.

 

The second is battery type, brand, model, and age. You will want to keep both batteries in your battery bank identical in all these respects.

 

My wife is from Taylor and she has a sister and extended family that lives and works in Taylor. We go there frequently, sometimes on our way to the Round Rock area to shop.

 

Good luck with your selections. I think these trailers will serve us well. I certainly look forward to using ours.

 

Doug

[technomadia]

I forgot to ask. Can deep cycle marine batteries be used interchangeably with Oliver?

 

There is nothing particularly special about a "marine" battery other than that they tend to be sold in boat stores. You can use a pair in your Oliver just fine.

 

Though, based on my observations, most Marine batteries tend to be hybrid starting / deep cycle batteries, and thus they have less deep cycling ability than a focused deep cycle battery.

 

- Chris

[dougi]

Question:

 

If someone buys and uses a battery charger like the Xantrex Truecharge 12V chargers (go here to see one to recharge the battery bank would that product take the place of the stock converter/charger that comes in the Oliver, or would that product be used in addition to and in conjunction with the stock converter/charger?

 

I am unclear on this point and any help would be appreciated. The question has to do with the available space in the Oliver, where the standard converter/charger is located. I'm wondering if I would have enough space to install this upgraded charger, especially if it is has to be used in addition to the standard converter/charger. If it takes the place of the standard converter/charger, then I'm pretty sure space to install the charger would not be an issue.

 

Chris? Anyone?

 

Thanks,

 

Doug

[dougi]

To follow up on my own question, I called Xantrex.

 

They said the standard converter/charger would not need to be installed in the trailer IF I instead purchased and installed the Xantrex Truecharge charger.

 

The standard converter/charger that Oliver installs in the trailers (cat# 34438) is available from Camping World for the regular price of $298.89, and it is on sale for $75 off from time to time. I can buy the Xantrex Truecharge 20+ for $340 or the 40+ for, IIRC, $440, which means it should not cost too much extra to go with the Xantrex Truecharge (or equilivant).

 

If I did that, it would be smart to also get the optional battery temperature sensor, a $30 or $40 option, which helps greatly when you recharge your battery bank at temperatures that very from 77 degrees F. (the assumed battery temperature for the not-so smart battery chargers).

 

Sounds like the way to go, especially if you have costly batteries to take care of and want them to last for a decade or longer. Of course one would also have to have a quality battery monitor (one that measures amp-hours discharged and recharged) to insure you don't overly (by more than 50%) discharge your battery bank.

[dougi]

Battery Charger Update:

 

I just purchased a factory reconditioned Xantrex Truecharge 40+ house battery charger from Marine Parts Source in Tennessee, along with a battery temperature sensor for $213.42 and $24.90 respectively. They are sending it directly to Oliver to be installed in my trailer. The chargers cost $324 new and have a one year warranty. The reconditioned units carry a 90 day warranty. If anyone ever needs any Xantrex warranty work, you can get it taken care of at Marine Parts Source in Tennessee. This is good to know.

 

I should receive credit from Oliver for their cost of the standard 45 Amp Intellli-Power Converter/Charger with built-in Charge Wizard.

 

If this works out as anticipated, I should be a happy camper, and my batteries (two 6V Trojan T-105's) will be well cared for and last a long time. I am having a BATMON battery monitor form Ample Power installed to monitor the battery bank amp-hours discharged and recharged (resettable to zero at any time), the amps draw from the battery bank, and the battery bank voltage.

 

Doug

[mountainborn]

Good info ! This is my first post from the new HTC 6800 !

[dougi]

Good info ! This is my first post from the new HTC 6800 !

 

What is a HTC 6800, Mountainborn?

[mountainborn]

oopz, sorry. It is a internet capable cell phone. I am on the job and dropped by to see who all was chattin'.

[bugeyedriver]

Mountainborn,

 

A new cell phone, great! I've always loved the photos you've shared that you took from your previous phone, but the hazy quality was frustrating. Does your new fangdangled phone take photos? Take a good'un and give us a look.

[ScubaRx]

Darn Pete, you mean to tell me that mountainborn's photos aren't supposed to look like he took them thru a foggy window. Well, who'da thought, and I was thinking of taking up some money and buying him a real camera for his birthday or something.....At least he's taking some and sharing with all the rest of us....

 

You keep up the GOOD work there, mountainborn, don't let all us flatlanders try to tell you how to take pictures. But, really will it take pics?

 

 

Steve

[mountainborn]

Sorry about the thread hijacking. I didn't intend to disrupt a good battery/charger thread.

Yes it will. After I learn how !

[dougi]

Well, the BATMON is no longer available from

Ample Power, so I ordered a Blue

Sky IPN-Pro battery monitor and controller, based on Chris's recommendation. I'm sure I will be pleased with it. The price for the monitor is now $189 plus shipping of about $18. I first went on e-bay to see if any were for sale there. No luck.

 

Doug

[herm]

Sounds like a nice setup, Doug. Though I'm surprised you're buying new Trojan T105's when you've got perfectly good Lifeline AMG's to spare.

 

I'm also going with Trojan T105's, though the best price I've found locally so far is $120 each. Just so you're aware there's also a T105 Plus, which is the same battery with flip-top watering caps (supposedly for easier topping off and less spillage). I'm assuming the Trojan's should be purchased with the low profile terminal (LPT), which has a threaded stud?

 

Since off-grid camping will probably be a rare event for me, I'm just going to stick with the standard charger. It is a smart charger with a passable amount of amp power, and that's good enough for me. I'm considering keeping the trailer plugged in at my home to keep the batteries at full charge during periods of non-use. Any reason NOT to do this, other than the cost of electricity? As a compromise, maybe plug in for one day every couple weeks? What are the rest of you (without solar panels) doing, if anything?

[dougi]

Herm, I'm not sure about your question regarding keeping your trailer's shore power plugged in permanently. I keep mine plugged in permanently but I have the ProSine 2.0 feeding the batteries the right amount of charge, and no solar panels hooked up. Perhaps the stock Oliver's 45 Amp Intelli-Power converter/charger with built-in Charge Wizard will do the same, but I would check with other owners to see what they are doing. Even that may not tell us the whole story because no one has had their trailers long enough to know what long-term effects this may be having on their batteries. I read that keeping your trailer hooked up to shore power on a long-term basis can overcharge/overheat your batteries and shorten their lives, unless you have a charger that prevents it.

 

If you are getting solar panels with a solar controller, I would not think you need to keep your trailer hooked up full-time and long-term to shore power. I would think your solar panels, together with the solar charge controller, would better serve the task of keeping your batteries topped off properly without the danger of overcharging and sulfating the plates.

 

Maybe Chris can give us some advice about this. Maybe Oliver can as well.

 

I am selling my 5th wheel trailer to my son-in-law, who will let me use it anytime I may want to do so. After paying all the money to upgrade the thing over the past 4 years, I thought it best to keep it in tack as it now sits, including the 4 AGM battery, 440 amp-hour battery bank. That is why I am not taking two batteries out of it. Another reason is that I don't want to have to carry those two batteries in the back of my RAV4 when I go to pick up my new trailer. We have to carry everything we need to use our new trailer for a few weeks when we travel to pick it up, and our RAV4 will be fully loaded on the trip up to Tennessee. I can always take out the batteries later, once I get the trailer home, if the Trojans don't serve my purpose well.

 

Doug

[mountainborn]

Herm said:

I'm considering keeping the trailer plugged in at my home to keep the batteries at full charge during periods of non-use. Any reason NOT to do this, other than the cost of electricity? As a compromise, maybe plug in for one day every couple weeks? What are the rest of you (without solar panels) doing, if anything?

>

Our Ollie is a earlier 08' with the smaller charger/inverter and a outboard charge wizzard, with the optima batterys.

It works well for our use. We boondock or drycamp most of the time. We leave it plugged in all of the time we are at home. Most of the time the charge wizzard has put the battery in "sleep" mode and the voltage stays up around full charge. In a few short months it will be a year since our Ollie came off of the assembly line and there is no sign of battery/voltage problems.

It seems to work well for our use.

[herm]

Thanks, mountainborn. It sounds like the charge wizard is designed to prevent overcharging by going to 'sleep' mode when the batteries reach full charge. If that's the case, there shouldn't be any reason to unplug the trailer at home, since the charger should only use electricity when it periodically comes out of sleep mode. Since I already have a weatherproof 30amp outlet on the house, having a permanent hookup would be the most convenient solution anyway.

 

Does the fact that I'll be using lead-acid batteries make them more susceptible to over-charging, compared to AGM's?

[dougi]

Herm, I think it does.

 

My understanding is that overcharging boils the electrolyte out of the battery through off-gassing, a thing that the flooded batteries are more susceptible to than the ABSORBED Glass Mat batteries. Also, the flooded batteries, like you and I are getting, are more susceptible to sulfation from being left in an undercharged condition for too long.

 

Bottom line: If you want to take good care of your batteries, regardless of their type, you need some knowledge and some instrumentation to do the best job.

 

I think all you need to confirm that the Charge Wizard is doing it's job when your batteries are plugged up to shore power is to make sure the voltage of your battery bank never exceeds 14.4 volts, the gassing threshold for flooded batteries. Ideally, the voltage should remain at between 13 and 14 volts, depending on if it is in sleep mode or is slowly charging.

 

Let's remember, about the only advantages flooded batteries have over AGM batteries is initial cost, and they can be purchased in more places when they go bad.

[jam49]

Hello to all,

I have been researching batteries after the fact of purchasing my Oliver. Now that I have had it almost a year, I have decided that I should have gotten the AGM batteries! I know they cost more but I think the price will be well worth it for me to buy them for the convenience of not having to check water levels.

Are the Concord/Lifeline AGM batteries still the best on the market?

Where is a good place to buy AGM batteries or would it be better to go online?

Is it better to use two 6 volt batteries with the higher AH or go with the two 12 volt batteries?

What brand?? works well for charging?

and, is it possible to have the batteries relocated to the front in the extra metal basket on my Oliver travel trailer? I struggle with lifting them in the built in storage area.

Thanks, Jam49

[SeaDawg]

Hello to all,

*****

Is it better to use two 6 volt batteries with the higher AH or go with the two 12 volt batteries?

What brand?? works well for charging?

and, is it possible to have the batteries relocated to the front in the extra metal basket on my Oliver travel trailer? I struggle with lifting them in the built in storage area.

Thanks, Jam49

We're still working on two year old standard group 27 batteries. I' m concerned about your comment on struggling to lift out your batteries. Why would there be a struggle when the compartment slides out? We are in FL, so there is no need to store batteries in the basement. Is it that much colder where you are in Texas?

Sher

[jam49]

Hi Sherry,

We have had some freezing weather. I had the battery charger in the garage and had to take the batteries out so that I could recharge them. The batteries are heavy and not real easy to take out or put back in to the sliding tray. I am learning a whole lot about batteries as I am trying to figure out the best way to take care of them --- push the red switch??? leave plugged in to shore power??? let the battery run down then charge??? add a battery disconnect on the battery?? so many questions. I have gotten some real good information online as I am searching for answers but I still have questions.

It sure would be good to have a question and answer manual. It sounds like there are others who have questiond whether to plug in to shore power continuously, etc. As always I sure appreciate the dialog. Hope yall are stayin' warm. jam49

[JuniorBirdMan]

Jennifer,

Unless you've got some kind of high tech smart charger in your garage, the charger in your Ollie will probably do a better job of caring for your batteries. A good source of info on batteries (all types) is here at: http://www.batteryuniversity.com if you haven't already found it in your searches.

For what it's worth, I have my Ollie hooked up to shore power full time with the batteries connected. I have Optima Blue Top AGMs and they get cycled at least once a month while dry camping. I never let the voltage drop below 12.0 under load. Also, I've never removed them from the trailer or disconnected them except to do electrical modifications (like my recently added 3-way switches for controlling the exterior lights). , I've only had about a year's experience and certainly am no expert. Only time will tell if I'm doing the right thing.

One thing from Battery University: lead-based batteries should be stored in a charged state.

Good luck with whatever maintenance practices you choose.

Aubrey