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Rivian EV towing and cost comparison


Zodd
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I thought this group might enjoy these videos. I had been wondering how these new EV trucks handle towing larger payload. Minus the range (which is a big issue) they seem very capable. If you are only a weekend warrior staying close to home and able to charge at home the Rivian seems pretty great. 

If you have ever been in Colorado and driven the IKE you will understand how serious of a towing test that is. The actual cost comparison video I found very interesting as I have been wondering what a break down like that would come out at. Results surprised me as well. 

Finally: The All-Electric Rivian R1T Takes On The World's Toughest Towing Test!

Towing With An Electric Truck - Is It Cheaper Than Gas? Rivian R1T vs Ford F-150 PowerBoost 

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I've watched a lot of TFL videos and I like there views on there test results. My personal view on electric vehicles is pretty much a no go at this time and the more it's pushed on us the less I like it. I think for those who want an intown vehicle to run around in is probably a buyable solution for some and if it can help save the planet and it works for you, them go for it. Being retired and using so little fuel in our vehicles it would never work out for us to go electric at this time. 

trainman

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Elite II, Twin Bed, Hull #489, 2019 RAM 1500, 5.7 Hemi, 4X4, Crew Cab, 5'7" bed, Towing Package, 3.92 Gears.

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Lots of torque in electric motors so they are great at pulling things, but the range and recharging capabilities aren't where they need to be yet. At least not for RVing.

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Stephanie and Dudley from CT.  2022 LE2, Hull #1150: Eggcelsior.

Tow vehicle: 2016 GMC Sierra 6.0 gas dually 4x4.

Our Oliver journey: Steph and Dud B's RV Screed

Where we've been RVing since 1999:

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New WA law - no new internal combustion cars and trucks (“all vehicles”) for sale in 8 years.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna21683

😳

There are going to be a WHOLE lot of unhappy rural farmers, truckers and RV owners,

John Davies

Spokane WA

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"Mouse":  2017 Legacy Elite II NARV (Not An RV) Two Beds, Hull Number 218, See my HOW TO threads: https://olivertraveltrailers.com/topic/john-e-davies-how-to-threads-and-tech-articles-links/

Tow Vehicle: 2013 Land Cruiser 200, 33" LT tires, airbags, Safari snorkel.

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@John E Davies I did see the announcement. According to Autoweek "The bill makes exemptions for vehicles with a weight over 10,000 pounds, as well as emergency vehicles." I have not read the full bill though. Either way that bill is going to shake things up in Washington.

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59 minutes ago, John E Davies said:

New WA law - no new internal combustion cars and trucks (“all vehicles”) for sale in 8 years.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna21683

😳

There are going to be a WHOLE lot of unhappy rural farmers, truckers and RV owners,

John Davies

Spokane WA

Great...more government trying to "do what's best for us".  Laws like this are conjured up by some dips**t politician pandering for donations to keep themselves in office.  Macro changes occur when something better comes along.  We aren't using a horse and buggy on a large scale anymore because cars are better for transportation.  You don't drive across the country for a business meeting, you fly.  My wife has a Telsa and it is a great car for how she uses it.  As you said though it wouldn't work for pulling  a trailer full of hay out in a field.  The other problem is cost.  You can't force Joe six pack to spend a years pay on a car, but I'm sure the state has a plan.🙄

 

John

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John and Kim

2021 GMC Sierra 2500 AT4 6.6L Duramax 11350 GVWR  3048lb Payload

2021 Oliver Elite II.   Hull #887

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Waiting to see my first Tesla Cybertruck, with a trailer in tow, parked across (blocking) ten superchargers in order to charge their Tow Vehicle.  Just wait, it's bound to happen once the truck has been launched.  🤣

2021 Elite II, Hull# 898

2018 Toyota Tundra, 2003 Dodge Ram 3500 5.9l SRW

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It's already happened with model x suvs towing trailers, though not ten stalls. Some of the newer Tesla charging stations have spots for vehicle plus trailer, but neither in my county are set up that way. Otherwise,  trailer has to be dropped, and reconnected. Another time consuming operation. 

All the stations in my county are busy, except at odd times. Evs have been quite well received,  here. Both superchargers are at WAWA stations. Always busy, when we've been there.

1 hour ago, Mountainman198 said:

Waiting to see my first Tesla Cybertruck, with a trailer in tow, parked across (blocking) ten superchargers in order to charge their Tow Vehicle.  Just wait, it's bound to happen once the truck has been launched.  🤣

Things will change. They always do.  

Towing, without adequate battery capacity,  will remain an issue, until things develop and change.

My great grandfather had one of the first "horseless carriages" in his county. In spring rain mud, he had to use the farm horses to drag the motorcar out the long muddy drive. Still drove it to town, though. Stubborn pioneer spirit, I guess. And wanted a better life for his family.

We'll get there, eventually,  with compromises, and research and development.  

That said, my gasser Silverado is soon celebrating birthday 17. They'll be around awhile.

 

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2008 Ram 1500 4 × 4

2008 Oliver Elite, Hull #12

 

 

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When I can get 600 miles a day, without charging, I will think about it. 
Right now I get 1200 miles between refills. As long as they keep the 18 wheels let’s going, I hope I will be fine.

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Early 1999 Ford F250 SD 7.3L Diesel 

2020 Elite II Twin -  Hull # 648

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The Living Vehicle can have over 3500 watts of solar, a back-up generator,  57.6 Kwh of lithium ion storage, and a plug to charge your EV. The Bruder Exp-8 has 1600 watts of solar with a 5000 watt interter and also an optional EV charging plug. These don't include portable panels. They are both insanely expensive, especially the Living Vehicle, but have the potential to be much more independent and off grid. It is exciting to think about. 

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Kirk and Carrie Peterson

Twin Falls, Idaho

2018 Ram 3500, 8 foot bed with overland conversion.

Elite 2: Due date December 5, 2022!

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The Living Vehicle requires a 3500 truck as a tow. Is there a HD electric Vehicle?

 

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Steve, Tali and the dogs: Reacher and Rocky plus our beloved Storm, Maggie and Lucy (all waiting at the Rainbow Bridge)

2008 Legacy Elite I - Outlaw Oliver, Hull #026 | 2014 Legacy Elite II - Outlaw Oliver, Hull #050 | 2022 Silverado High Country 3500HD SRW Diesel 4x4 

 

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I watched the video in part but like the vast majority of youtube videos there was far too much unnecessary clamoring  that had little to any relevance to the primary intent of the test so I skipped through most of it to get to the results. Who in their right mind would buy a truck like this to only be able to tow 100 miles ± a few? I'm all for an alternative energy, but this seems so misplaced and on so many different levels. Also the claims the Rivian was "100 times better" at towing than the F150 seems a bit dubious at best, especially given the drivers enthusiastic waxing about how great the F150 was while driving it. Seriously a pint size truck is better at towing and handling than a full size half ton pickup (of any make or model), really. The torque of the electric motors at which wheel is understandable but beyond that I have my doubts. 

The biggest disappointment was the F150 not being able to use its onboard battery power to assist in the towing, relegating all the duties to gas power and what many might not know unless Ford has changed the specs the smaller gas tank is only available in these hybrid models. IOW's you only have a gas tank of about 25 gallons instead of the 36 gallon tank. Stupid decision on Fords part with this IMHO. 

As someone else stated we just aren't there yet and probably will not be for a very long time to come. Have my doubts battery power in this application will ever suffice.

Legacy Elite II #70

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I await a company which will develop and launch a true Series Hybrid HD pickup, capable of towing on diesel long distances while running on battery short distances for errands around town and unladen commutes.  Then I will get excited.  

Full disclosure, our household has utilized a Chevrolet Volt for 6 yrs and appreciate the EV operation for commutes, errands and short jaunts near home, while having the option of heading cross-country on gas at 45 m.p.g.

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2021 Elite II, Hull# 898

2018 Toyota Tundra, 2003 Dodge Ram 3500 5.9l SRW

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Our country’s electrical grid/infrastructure is ancient and extremely vulnerable to terrorist attack. Or better said it just old and very out dated and would take very little effort by bad actors to take it down. The occasional peak summer power outages resulting in rolling black outs especially in west coast states is noteworthy. (Thankfully we don’t live there). 
It seems the cart is before the horse as a new secure and sustainable electrical infrastructure should be a first priority before attempting to over load the existing ancient electrical grid we all presently rely on.

Interestingly enough Fords CEO went to congress recently to ask/beg for go green EV tax incentives to attract buyers to new EVs is a bit telling. It’s hard to imagine ICE going away anytime soon.  Interesting times for sure. 
 

On a more humorous note…😂 I will be ordering one soon.

 

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2020 OLEII - Hull #634   TV -2021 F 350 6.7 liter Diesel Lariat Ultimate “Tremor”

 

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4 hours ago, ScubaRx said:

The Living Vehicle requires a 3500 truck as a tow. Is there a HD electric Vehicle?

 

05128E4B-085F-42FD-A49D-0DC3BC985C47.jpeg

Very funny..

Eventually,  there will be.

Electric motors and direct drive more resemble vin diesel. Just have to figure it all out. 

Newer lighter battery technology is undoubtedly coming, with more readily available components.

Pretty sure Ford dropped the 350/450 ev  exploration for the time being, as the Lightning has sold so well, and is so powerful. The 350/450 are work trucks. Got to have range, and capability. 

Frankly, I too would likely wait for newer lighter, more eco-friendly battery development. Or, look at the tech used for a long time for diesel- electric locomotives and ships.

For me, I'd want pure electric. I don't really love the idea of hybrid, two systems to maintain. Personal opinion.

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2008 Ram 1500 4 × 4

2008 Oliver Elite, Hull #12

 

 

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7 hours ago, routlaw said:

Also the claims the Rivian was "100 times better" at towing than the F150 seems a bit dubious at best, especially given the drivers enthusiastic waxing about how great the F150 was while driving it.

Totally agree. That was the part that bugged me the most as well. 

I agree this technology is not there yet for towing or even long road trips. It is interesting though with lots of things happening. Like the lithium-sulfur battery that some are projecting could do 900 miles. Early days still on all this, but exciting to see the innovation.

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The infrastructure isn't there for 100 per cent , or even 40 per cent, ev. Charging networks, other than Tesla, are scattered, often lame and inferior. And, the new networks are often slow and  geared to local traffic.

We charge mostly at home. 

Changes will happen. I just hope as states mandate change, that they help make it happen, to meet the mandates they create. It's expensive,  and intensive.

So far, Tesla is the only realistic way to take a long trip. In a car.

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2008 Ram 1500 4 × 4

2008 Oliver Elite, Hull #12

 

 

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So.. interesting video..     For Oliver owners we can expect a modest savings moneywise while on the road.   More reading and leisure time while waiting for the EV to charge... a LOT more reading time considering we will have to charge every 100 miles or so.    BUT... if we charge at home we can expect up to an 80% savings.   No problem... I never tow my Oliver more than 50 miles from home anyway.  

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Gregg & Donna Scott and Piper the Westie  -    The Flying Sea Turtle - Hull # 145     Western NC


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Can you imagine taking a 600-700 mile (one way) camping trip with necessary charging every 100-150 miles which takes what was it 45 minutes for a DC quick charge and that's if you can find a charge station you can fit into without unhitching and re-hitching. Might take 2-3 days to get to your destination. Puts new meaning on plan ahead.

I've not heard of Lithium sulphur batteries, will look into that.

Legacy Elite II #70

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3 hours ago, routlaw said:

Can you imagine taking a 600-700 mile (one way) camping trip with necessary charging every 100-150 miles which takes what was it 45 minutes for a DC quick charge and that's if you can find a charge station you can fit into without unhitching and re-hitching. Might take 2-3 days to get to your destination. Puts new meaning on plan ahead.

And you can forget going to Alaska.

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Steve, Tali and the dogs: Reacher and Rocky plus our beloved Storm, Maggie and Lucy (all waiting at the Rainbow Bridge)

2008 Legacy Elite I - Outlaw Oliver, Hull #026 | 2014 Legacy Elite II - Outlaw Oliver, Hull #050 | 2022 Silverado High Country 3500HD SRW Diesel 4x4 

 

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Hello all,

First time poster, long time browser. We pick up our Ollie Elite II in about a month.

This topic piqued my interest as a hybrid truck owner. The Ike test from TFL is just a good benchmark on the capability, especially at elevation. Perhaps in 10 years we'll be able to compare range and towing for full EVs, but we're not there yet. 

We have a Ford F150 Powerboost Lariat and I think it's a great all around truck for our purposes. 1) Towing an Ollie. 2) Commuting to work a few days a week (30 mi each way). 3) We live at elevation in CO (6,200ft) where a turbo is ideal for hauling up mountain passes (such as the Ike, which I've done countless times). We looked at RAM and others, including Diesels of all variations, and it came down to cost benefit and fit. While it would be nice to have a HD truck for the added payload, I just couldn't justify it for various reasons; can't fit in our garage, too tall for parking at work (can't commute with it), diesel maintenance, and the premium over a gasser. I wanted something that would be a good TV and a decent commuter. The Powerboost fits the bill perfectly.

Our truck has a 30 gallon gas tank (standard on all F150 Powerboosts). Max Trailer tow package. 430hp/570 torque. 1425 Payload. It gets about 24 mpg normal commute driving, and sometimes I get 30 mpg if I baby it along. Usually 30mpg to work and 22mpg on the way back. Stop-and-Go traffic is a breeze, as it's mostly in EV mode and will drive itself in traffic if I choose to allow it.

When I need to tow, the truck performs well, plenty of power. While it's not much weight, I towed our Casita and got 15-17 mpg on the flats. I'm expecting 10-14 with the Ollie Elite II.

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Paul and Carrie | 2022 Oliver Elite II. "Luna" | 2022 Ford F-150 Powerboost Hybrid Lariat FX4 Max Tow package | Two pups, Ollie and Lincoln

 

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3 hours ago, MHCamper said:

Our truck has a 30 gallon gas tank (standard on all F150 Powerboosts). Max Trailer tow package. 430hp/570 torque. 1425 Payload. It gets about 24 mpg normal commute driving, and sometimes I get 30 mpg if I baby it along. Usually 30mpg to work and 22mpg on the way back. Stop-and-Go traffic is a breeze, as it's mostly in EV mode and will drive itself in traffic if I choose to allow it.

When I need to tow, the truck performs well, plenty of power. While it's not much weight, I towed our Casita and got 15-17 mpg on the flats. I'm expecting 10-14 with the Ollie Elite II.

Good information. I had been under the impression the PB F150 had a much smaller gas tank. We have an older F150 3.5 Eco Boost and under ideal conditions which doesn't always happen out west we can get up to 14.5 mpg towing our Elite II and only a few times has it dropped down to as low as 10 mpg and that was under some terrible driving conditions with howling winds. Averages fall somewhere in between. 

I do find it odd Ford did not allow this setup to use battery power to assist in towing however. 

Legacy Elite II #70

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52 minutes ago, routlaw said:

Good information. I had been under the impression the PB F150 had a much smaller gas tank. We have an older F150 3.5 Eco Boost and under ideal conditions which doesn't always happen out west we can get up to 14.5 mpg towing our Elite II and only a few times has it dropped down to as low as 10 mpg and that was under some terrible driving conditions with howling winds. Averages fall somewhere in between. 

I do find it odd Ford did not allow this setup to use battery power to assist in towing however. 

Thanks for the info, routlaw, my guess is just about on point with the MPGs while towing. I also wish the Hybrid portion would apply to towing, but I think the battery capacity is a bit small to provide any meaningful towing power as it is. While not towing, the EV works very well around town, in parking lots, and in traffic especially. At the same time, able to tap into the rocket of the ecoboost engine. Whoooboy.. that is fun.

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Paul and Carrie | 2022 Oliver Elite II. "Luna" | 2022 Ford F-150 Powerboost Hybrid Lariat FX4 Max Tow package | Two pups, Ollie and Lincoln

 

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