LiFeBlueBattery

I feel I need to mention one thing that is vitally important to anyone considering Lithium Ion batteries. If the battery does not have low temperature protection that prevents accidentally charging the cells when they are frozen, you can cause permanent damage to the battery. The damage can then lead to internal short circuiting and possibly fire. Buyer due diligence is necessary as many import batteries don't have this protection.

Hi Overland, I saw the many questions you have. As soon as possible I'll provide answers. We are very busy right now so please give me some time. Larry

Hello Mike, A MPPT controller should be used with any PV solar modules (aka solar panel, a misnomer) that has a Vmp (the operating voltage) of 17.0V or higher. It does not matter what kind of battery you have. A PWM controller is like a switch: it turns on and off and will only pass the rated current of your module. This causes you to loose potential power which I’ll explain later. A MPPT controller can capture all the power that a module can produce by using DC converters. Consider this example: 100W PV module rated at 20 Vmp and 5 Imp (the output current). According to Ohms law, Volts x Amps = Watts. So, for our above module, here's the math: 20V x 5A = 100W. Also know that a solar module is a constant current device. In our example, you will get about 5 Amps from 0 to 20 volts. A PWM controller will directly connect the PV module to the battery. A battery is a load and will pull down the voltage of the module. If the battery is 13 volts, here's the math: 13V X 5A = 65W. You only produce 65 Watts of power because the amperage is at 5A and the voltage is pulled down to 13V. If you use MPPT controller with the same module, you can produce nearly 100 Watts of power. The difference is that the MPPT controller converts the 20 Vmp down to 13V and raises the current at the same time. By this conversion process, you can raise current because the power (100W) is still available. You now get about 7.5 Amps from your 100W solar module. Here’s the math: 13 x 7.5 = 100W (you loose some in the conversion process) There are other factors affecting performance but using MPPT for high voltage modules is important. Hope this helps!

Hello , All LiFeBlue Batteries sold by Oliver TT have the full warranty. See attached letter of exemption. Oliver TT LiFeBlue warranty exemption.pdf

Just one other point if it will help. We sell thousands of Li-ion batteries that are being installed in boats and RV's every day. We field lots of phone calls and emails from DIY'ers about alternator charging. We always recommend our Auxiliary Charge design for high current alternator charging. No one has contacted us with any trouble. Many of our customers use Sprinter Vans or new Ford trucks that have very finicky electrical systems. Happy Trails!

Yes, Starlight Solar Power Systems in Yuma, AZ.

Hi Overland, My experience designing and installing the systems that I have described and regular study is the source of my undersatnding. People must chose who they want to believe. We operated a retail store in Yuma, AZ and had thousands of customers over about 2 decades until May 2018. Every day we would talk to customers that had a false understanding and wrong ideas about how things work. We would spend a great deal of our time educating people so they would have a good experience with their RV power systems. Here's a example: Have you ever hear someone say "you can only use 50% of a deep cycle lead acid battery"? Yes, you and every other reader of this post has heard that. That rumor started about 6 years ago and spread like covid 19. Well, that statement is completely false. Yet, I have heard it from Battleborn, AM Solar and tons of other experts, even a major battery distributor that should know better. I understand you have beliefs and it won't be to anyone's advantage to enter a controversial conversation here. In closing, here's something I said a long time ago that is still apropos : "The internet exposes you to a world of passionate people with strong opinions. Many are formed in ignorance from bias or lack of understanding. Be careful what you believe.” Larry Crutcher Happy Trails to you all!

Hi Overland, I can only say that with hundreds of auxiliary charge systems installed by us for both LA and Li, (1) no one has reported to us they had a problem charging the house battery with our charge circuit, (2) nor has anyone damaged their alternator. (3) We never installed a DC converter (battery to battery) in any of our Aux. charge circuits. (4) What did happen is customers wrote to us with great appreciation for saving them the need to buy and carry a generator and fuel. Our design works very well. I am sure that I would have had claims about this if something did not work as we would charge about $600 for the Aux. charge circuit parts and labor. I have attached some photos of one of our Aux. charge circuit installations for a TT. Hope this helps.

Hello, I have attached a letter of Exemption. All LiFeBlue Batteries sold by Oliver include all the benefits of the 10 Year Limited Warranty. Oliver TT LiFeBlue warranty exemption.pdf

Hilarious! But, that photo looks very much like my first wind turbine project in 1978.

Charging is more about necessity so efficiency is less important. If you can arrive with fully charged batteries, life is good.

Hi John and Anita, This is not true. LiFeBlue Battery can be charged with any voltage above the resting voltage (about 13.5V) and can easily be fully charged from your alternator with the proper auxiliary charge circuit. Happy Trails!

Hello Overland, Here are some answers that may be helpful to many. First, start with the understanding that for more than 50 years millions of motorhomes are charging both the chassis and house battery every time they run the main engine. In a motorhome, or in your TV auxiliary charge circuit, there is a solenoid that connects all batteries in parallel when the ignition is on. When all batteries are connected to the alternator, the output voltage is pulled down because a load (battery and other loads) is present. The alternator will increase current trying to raise the voltage set by the controller or regulator. This is how power is transferred in any circuit and is automatic. Current from the alternator is flowing to all loads. The chassis battery needs less power to recover than the house battery needs. When it becomes saturated (fully charged), current to that battery goes to about zero. The house battery needs more time to charge so current flows to it until the alternator voltage is reached. Then current will decrease until the house battery is full. It does not matter to the alternator what kind of load is present, it supplies current until voltage is met. Since LiFeBlue Battery has such broad charge characteristics, it can be charged by any alternator with out needing a DC converter. I don’t know what is wrong with your truck. We have designed and installed over 3000 RV power systems and they all work as I have described above. Idling an engine can produce 80-100 Amps and use about 0.5 gallons per hour doing so. Not bad for not having to carry a generator and fuel can. I agree, most won't be charging at 3kW. But you can easily charge with 1000 Watts with the diagram I supplied. Wire size should be calculated to achieve high current. In the last 7 years, with hundreds of Li battery installs, we have never had a customer indicate a failed alternator. I hope this is helpful.

Thanks Mike and Carol and SeaDawg. Glad to be here to help.

Hi Overland, By using the alternator charge diagram attached to another post, you can use the TV alternator as a high current charge source. We have designed and installed this circuit for many people over the last 20 years. With the inverter that Oliver is providing, you would not need to carry a generator as the alternator, battery and inverter make the equivalent of a 3kW generator. Also, the solenoid will prevent any current draw from the truck battery when the ignition is off. Happy Trails!

Hi again Susan, I'm trying to work through al these emails. No, you can not harm LiFeBlue by leaving them connected to the alternator for any length of time. No need to do anything with fuses. Just hook up and have an adventure.

Hi Mossey, Thank you for adding that. I need some help. I can't see where to setup my signature in the profile settings. I would like that to be at the bottom of every post. Thanks in advance.

Hi Again, Our battery has a special BMS designed for just this situation. You can not harm our battery using the alternator, even at high power with a larger cable setup. Our BMS can accept a very broad current and voltage input. Basically it will take whatever you can supply. I hope this is helpful. Let me know if you have more questions.

Hi Ray and Susan, For any TV to charge the house battery, you should install a circuit from the TV battery to the House battery using large cables and connectors. I am attaching a PDF file with suggestions on how to do this. I can't express how important this is to have unless you want to carry a generator and only charge while stationary. Many people with a proper charge circuit do not even carry a generator. They just idle the main engine to charge the battery or while driving. BTW, you would want this kind of charge circuit for any battery chemistry. Alternator Charge Circuit copy.pdf

Hello Susan, So glad to hear you have chosen the Pro package. It is a worry free design. We worked with Oliver to get the best package for their trailers. You can leave LiFeBlue battery connected to any charge source of any voltage up to 16 Volts. Once a single cell is saturated (fully charged) at 3.8 Volts, the BMS will inhibit all charge current and report "Battery Over Voltage" on the event page in your Smart Connect App. Don't let that scare you. It just means the battery will not accept any more charge because it is full. For long term shore power use, your charger will lower the voltage to 13.8 Volts. Hope this s helpful!

Don't forget to add the cost and weight for the battery monitoring system that is a necessity for other Li battery brands. There is also additional weight for the battery cables.

Hello John and Anita, First let me correct a misunderstanding. The LiFeBlue Battery BMS was specifically designed for RV and Marine applications where multiple charge sources are contributing power, at different voltages and current levels, sometimes all at once. Our BMS will allow a very broad power input. You can use anything from 1 Amp to full rated current as listed on the data sheet, and any voltage above the resting voltage up to 16 volts. You won't hurt our battery doing this. As long as you don't exceed the maximum current, you can use any amount to charge our battery. You don't need 120 Amps as stated. The 15 minute is an Absorb time to allow our cells to top balance and to recalibrate the SoC meter for accuracy. About Alternators Using your tow vehicle alternator as a backup power source is a great way to make power for loads and to charge the battery. Since there is not much roof space for PV solar power, this makes alternator charging even more important for boondocking. We have designed many hundreds of alternator charge systems over the years. These customers did not need to carry a generator. With the right size cable and minimal system losses, you can deliver 80 Amps or more from a tow vehicle alternator while just idling the engine. LiFeBlue Battery will start accepting current at about 13.5 Volts. At that voltage, current will be very low. You should design for no more than 1% voltage drop from the alternator to the house battery if you need high current from the alternator. I hope this helps.

Hello Jairon, Our warranty is not written as a "gotcha" ploy to avoid taking care of our products. But, some people abuse products and then want the manufacturer to be responsible. I think that is rare but it still requires the language in the warranty. An example of using the BMS for regulation and repetitive cycling would be someone applies 150 Amps to a 100AH battery (this has happened). The BMS will cycle off and on with the Over-current protection while trying to accept the high current. Through many cycles, heat could build up until the thermal shutdown begins cycling. These cascading events can cause the BMS to burn out. Our warehouse and service center is in Yuma, AZ.

Hello to all Oliver Travel Trailer owners. I am here as the company representative to answer any of your questions specifically related to LiFeBlue Li-ion Battery. LiFeBlue supplies Oliver TT with LiFePO4 chemistry batteries to power your loads. All of our batteries have Smart Connect Bluetooth communications built in. Having 20 years of experience designing and installing thousands of RV, Marine, off grid and industrial battery based power systems, I am also wiling to share my broad knowledge with this group if it is requested. My wife and I have a good understanding of the full time RV lifestyle having spent a few years on the road. Happy Trails to you all! Larry Crutcher, GM

Hello All, We are honored to be a supplier of Li-ion batteries for Oliver Travel Trailers. My purpose on the forum is to offer you the best customer service and support. If you have any questions let me know how I can help. Larry Crutcher, GM LiFeBlue Battery sales@lifebluebattery.com (920) LiFePO4 (920) 543-3764