Minnesota Oli
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Posts posted by Minnesota Oli
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Carl
I have the Honda 2200 with propane conversion and has no problem starting AC from eco mode running from ether fuel source. Wish you good luck with your project. Happy to answer any question you might have.
Paul
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Ocala Guy
If you go to Micro Air Easy start website, they have resources on how to install their product plus specific schematic for the Houghton AC. Print them off for reference when installing. Under the hood of the Houghton space is limited, you can't see from the pictures but there are two electrical boxes, one on each side of the insulated portion of the AC. Looking at the pictures, the enclosure that has the lead wire from the Micro Air soft start going to it contains the capacitor you will need to connect to. You will also have to run wire to the other enclosure to connect the black wire from Easy Start to the switched-L-1 connects coming from the main control board or main contactor that connects to the compressor common terminal wire. I chose to make a shorter wire run directly to compressor just in front of the over load protection devise.
For mounting the Micro Air I used Velcro but added two straps made from banding to help support it since it was hook to Styrofoam.
Paul
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I thought I would call Battle Born Batteries and ask them about this issue with camping in hot temps. First I looked at their website and found this information.
Temperature restrictions on Battle Born Batteries
Battle Born Batteries protect themselves from charging in cold temperatures and won’t accept a charge once the internal cell temperature drops to 24°F. At this point they will continue to discharge even down to -4°F. At this temperature we recommend no longer pulling power to avoid damaging the batteries.
Insulated battery boxes, heating blankets, and placing your battery bank inside your RV will help keep the temperature stable. On the high end of temperature range, the batteries will shut down once 135°F is reached.
When talking to the representative he advised me that I would see a slight loss of performance in 105 and plus degrees battery temperature but it would not hurt your battery and it would retain it normal performance once you were in cooler climate and battery temp drop below 105 degrees, also the battery will shut down once 135 degrees is reached in the battery. He said that it has not been a problem with RV users.
I think in the case of the Oliver with it's battery not in the direct sunlight I don't think they'll be a problem. I would suggest anyone trying to make a decision on what battery type to buy should contact the battery manufacture and get all of their concerns answered. I know at Battle Born the rep was very knowledgeable and friendly and would probably talk to you all day.
Paul
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On 4/9/2021 at 3:37 PM, Minnesota Oli said:
I will chime in because I went with Dicor lap sealant non leveling. I applied it to the under side of the outside mount frame and put it in the opening with four bolts in place. Then I put the inside mount frame in place and hand tightened the nuts with very little force. This assured me the all was lined up properly. I smooth out what squeezed out by dipping my finger in water and forming a bead around the frame. I let this sit for 24 hours before installing the ac. When I torqued the bolt to 9 ft lbs I looked up on top and saw a couple spots where my formed bead had some small bulges but I'm satisfied that I have a good seal. When time permits I'm planing to write up my version of this AC install.
My version of Houghton AC install.
Start out by cutting 120 volt power to AC and 12 volt power to furnace. Next remove the plenum of the Dometic Penguin II on the inside of the Oliver. This will expose a group of wires that are in a black sheath, these are the control side of the wiring for the AC. These go to a LCD relay board that controls Cool/Furnace/Heat Strip that is mounted up in the AC. You will also see a metal electrical 4" x 2" Handy Box that will have the 120 volt power supply for the AC. Both sets of wires can then be disconnected and the four bolts holding the AC on can be removed, this allows you to remove the AC from the roof of Oliver.
The Houghton AC will not be using the Dometic thermostat that's mounted on the wall because it comes with a remote but your furnace still needs the wall thermostat which works with the LCD Relay Board. I wanted to preserve my old AC with the LCD relay board intact for resale, so I purchased a replacement board mounted it in a plastic box. I installed it in the area where my tank monitor is with the access through pantry.
Where I disconnected the control side of the wiring harness from the AC I then connected wires long enough to be routed back to the new LCD relay board that is mounted next to the pantry.
I then connected those wires to the relay board. One other item is the relay board has a freeze sensor that needs to be hook up or you will get a error message. That sensor is mounted in the cooling fins on the AC, so I had a temp sensor left over from a refrigerator repair I did a while back and that worked as a replacement.
The Houghton comes with a roof mount frame, this gets a sealant applied to the under side of it and that is set in the opening in the roof, I used Dicor Lap Sealant. The roof has a slight radius built in to it to help shed water so the flat roof mount frame will tend to teeter in the opening. I applied the sealant to the under side of the outside mount frame and put it in the opening with four bolts in place. Then I put the inside mount frame in place and hand tightened the nuts with very little force. This assured me the all was lined up properly. I smooth out what squeezed out by dipping my finger in water and forming a bead around the frame. I let this sit for 24 hours before installing the ac. When I torqued the bolt to 9 ft lbs I looked up on top and saw a couple spots where my formed bead had some small bulges but I'm satisfied that I have a good seal.
I made the 120 volt connection to the AC with waterproof connectors and discarded 4" x 2" Handy Box so I would have less obstructions in the air passageways. I also used aluminum foil tape to smooth the transition between the two mount frames.
As a sidenote halfway through the install I thought of a different way of doing the wiring for the thermostat. If a person replaced the LCD thermostat with a older manual style you could do away with the LCD relay board. If you look at the first picture that shows a group of wires that are in a black sheath, these are the control side of the wiring for the AC. In that group of wires there are two blue wires one with a white stripe. The one with the white stripe is hot 12 volts DC and the solid blue is the wire that goes to the furnace relay board. So re-allocate the existing thermostat wires by doubling them up ,two of them hooked to the solid blue and the other two hook to the blue with the white stripe. Then at the wall hook the two thermostat wires that are hooked to blue with white stripe to the power in on the new manual thermostat and the other two to the power out. The reason I would double them up is because of they're small gauge. This would do away with having to pull wires and using the LCD relay board. Also save you having to toggle through the unusable modes (heat strip, cool) on the LCD thermostat to get to the furnace mode.
I am very pleased with the sound levels of this AC, you can easily have a conversation between two people without any difficulty of hearing each other. Plus it also has heat mode and dry mode.
I should have done this write up sooner when it was fresh in my mind. Oh well.
Paul
PS I also installed the Micro Air EasyStart. I wanted to ensure that my Honda 2200 would be able to start the AC from eco- mode. You can see from the pictures it was very tight space to mount the unit.
The captured inrush amps before installation was 67.1 and 48.9 after install.
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13 minutes ago, River Rat said:
Hey Minnesota Oli, thanks for this!
You mean to say I don't NEED to change my inverter? Somehow I presumed i had to go w/ pure sine wave when converting.... can't explain the rationale that made me arrive at this conclusion, but this is, indeed, great news for my dusty wallet:)
@SeaDawg, these poor AGMs are badly swolen, and no longer keep a charge for >15 minutes or so. Yikes!
I have all the stock charge controllers, the Zamp ZS-30A solar charger does have as selectable battery type on the display panel with LiFePO4 as a option. Battle Born did advised me to disconnect the temperature probe from the Zamp solar controller. The Progressive Dynamics Power Center charger has a selectable jumper on the board that needs to be put LiFePO4. The stock inverter only takes DC and converts to AC nothing to do with charging.
Paul
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I have upgraded to 4) 100AH Battleborn, and also added Victron Smart shunt. I kept all other factory installed charging components only switching them to LiFePo.
We had spent the last two weeks of April in Utah and Colorado with out ever being hooked up to shore power. We had to use the furnace every night and used inverter for coffee pot every morning and some use of microwave. I was happy to see that my batteries were always at 100 percent after a short time of solar charge. So at this point I am not planing on up grading my charging components, time will tell.
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Here's a link to Dicor web site.
https://dicorproducts.com/product/non-leveling-lap-sealants/
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I will chime in because I went with Dicor lap sealant non leveling. I applied it to the under side of the outside mount frame and put it in the opening with four bolts in place. Then I put the inside mount frame in place and hand tightened the nuts with very little force. This assured me the all was lined up properly. I smooth out what squeezed out by dipping my finger in water and forming a bead around the frame. I let this sit for 24 hours before installing the ac. When I torqued the bolt to 9 ft lbs I looked up on top and saw a couple spots where my formed bead had some small bulges but I'm satisfied that I have a good seal. When time permits I'm planing to write up my version of this AC install.
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2 hours ago, NCeagle said:
And my .01 cents (only half as good as what katanapilot has done)...
I did something similar to what katanapilot did but I was a bit more lazy. 🙂 I removed the 120V connections from inside the relay box as that's mandatory to connect to the new Houghton. Once those connections are gone it is easy to remove the board as katanapilot did. This is where I got lazy - rather than remove the compressor relay, trim the board and fit it into a custom box, I just wrapped the board in a non-conductive plastic bubble wrap bag and secured it up in a void in the new AC unit. Maybe I'll do it right and do the extra work that katanapilot did one day - especially if my board fries in the bag. 😬 "Right" for me would be not having that board in the Houghton at all - I'd just put a new board near the furnace and run a new set of wires.
I don't have the E5 error like katanapilot. My freeze sensor is connected directly to my thermostat apparently as the sensor and wire come out of the wire bundle - not the relay. So I suspect mine was set up slightly differently than katanapilot's but not sure. I just rolled up the wire and stuffed it back into the roof with the thermostat sensor intact. No issues yet.
Minnesota Oli, definitely looking forward to a report back on your install after seeing the amazing work you did on the street side heat duct!
I really value the feedback from both you and Katanapilot, this will be my first experience with RV furnaces , AC's and thermostats. Looking forward to the project and learning the ins and outs of it.
Thanks Again
Paul
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2 hours ago, katanapilot said:
I'll offer my two cents as to how I modified the relay board and box. I removed the AC power lines from the box and reused the quick connect wire connectors from the Ollie's romex wire to the new Houghton AC lines. I would normally use wire nuts or similar, but I assume OTT has had good results with the quick connectors and if they become problematic - they are easy to change. I opened up the Dometic relay box and removed the board from the box. I removed the large AC relay (that controlled the compressor on the Dometic A/C) as described in a earlier post. I trimmed a couple of corners on the relay board using the pencil grinder and cut slots in the new box for the DC wire connections to/from the thermostat and furnace. I put the cover on the new box, connected the thermostat and furnace wires and attached high strength velcro to the box. This smaller box fit nicely up in the void in the plenum (picture provided earlier). I did not save the freeze sensor from the Dometic A/C as the only use for it would be to prevent the "E5" error code that shows up when the Dometic thermostat is powered up. It doesn't bother me and it doesn't affect the functionality of the thermostat in furnace mode.
Sorry I didn't take a bunch of pictures.
Hey thanks for the reply. I received my Houghton AC last week and now have time to do the install. I appreciate you sharing your research and solution to the noisy Dometic , I think the hard interior of the Oliver makes it worse. I have been following this topic and see that several other owners have made the improvement but have not mentioned anything of this issue of Dometic thermostat requiring Dometic AC for the Dometic furnace to function. Then my Oliver is a 2019 and maybe theirs is set up with different equipment. Well thanks again, I can now move forward with the install now that I have a better understanding of what I dealing with.
Paul
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If I understand correctly you have to pull the control board from the AC and mount it somewhere in the opening so you can still use the furnace through the existing thermostat. If that is right could you describe the process.
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Could you convert the files to standard JPEG? Would love to see your project!
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I received this from a friend who lives in Nevada. Struck my fun bone thought you all might enjoy.
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Hi John
A ton of food for thought I really appreciate you taking the time and effort to share with the rest of us. I had to chuckle when you mentioned the nicely drilled hole for flooding hot air it does not compare to your ability to run test, record and chart the results.
Thanks again
Paul
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11 hours ago, Carl Hansen said:
Greetings!
Do you have the rear bumper receiver? How do you use it? Can you comment on the quality and durability of the receiver? Is it well built and solid construction?
We love cycling, so we plan on using the rear receiver for our bikes. Depending on our destination, we will take either our mountain bikes or our road bikes. We have NV 2.0 Kuat hitch rack and will need to use a adapter since our rack is the 2" model. We also have the Kuat Pivot v2 that we use to swing the bikes 90 degrees to access the back of the Gladiator. I don't think there is a need for the Pivot with the Ollie.
It looks good from the pictures, but I wanted feedback from those who might already have the rear bumper receiver.
Thanks!
Carl
Carl
I have the Oliver bumper receiver option. I made a few changes and if interested can be seen at Ollie Modification under Modified Receiver Hitch.
Paul
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Someone on Oliver Forum replying to a topic made the statement that the Oliver trailer is really more of mobile tiny home then a camper, and I agree with that. Having your home ready for what ever you may run in to gives peace of mind so a person can really enjoy the time while out having adventures.
I really like your ideas of building in redundancies in to the heating systems. Like what I said in my post, my mods are totally reliant on the furnace functioning and that includes not having problems with propane supply and how it has problems with gasifying in subzero temps.
I think that when everyone shares there ideas we will be able to come close to having the security of our homes built in to our Oliver.
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Hi John
This 6061 aluminum, I had little bit of it on hand. It description from the catalog is; This is the most versatile of the heat treatable aluminum alloys. It has most of the good qualities of aluminum, and it offers a wide range of mechanical properties and corrosion resistance.
Applications- This grade is used for a wide variety of products and applications from truck bodies and frames to screw machine parts and structural components.
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On 2/11/2021 at 7:54 PM, Minnesota Oli said:
I will try to make up some prints and get them posted.
Here are some prints of the main parts needed to mount flaps. i just want to make a couple of points to maybe help someone making this mod. The first one is to remind people that this is a wonderful custom built trailer and like snowflakes they may look the same but each one is unique in it's self. I strongly recommend that you take the print and build a mock up out of a stiff piece of cardboard or a thin piece of plywood. Then put up in place and check the fit of the mount holes and how it aligns with the fender well. This way you will see if adjustments to the holes need to be made. The part that the rubber flap is bolted to has to align perpendicular to the trailers main frame and be aligned with the trailing edge of the wheel well. This way when the rubber flap is bolted on it will extend a little way up into the wheel well and also match the seam of the trim that goes around the outside of the wheel well. You may have to refer to the pictures included in this post to see what I mean, pictures are truly worth thousand words. I suggest getting the main mount plate held by the mounting bolts of the stabilizer jack, checking position and alignment to the wheel well then hold or clamp 3" x 12"long x 1/2" thick plate up against the trailer frame and aligned with the edge of the mount plate. Now transfer the two 1/4" mounting holes positions to the edge of the 3" x 12" plate. These can now be drilled and tapped.
On my trailer the curbside stabilizer jack is mounted 1/2" closer to the wheel then the street side that is why there are two sets of prints for that part.
They are somewhat picky to install, but I think they are the most effective at protecting the trailer.
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49 minutes ago, John E Davies said:
Paul, is the insulation sheet perhaps for a residential furnace or duct? I am trying to get an idea of R value, type of material and where to get it.
John Davies
Spokane WA
It is piece of acoustical insulation that was for large generator enclosure, it was 1-1/2" thick and 19" square. I believe It is open cell foam with a black finish that seals the cells on the one side and the other side has adhesive applied with a plastic tear off sheet. Just the edges would have exposed open cell, I would not expect the R-value to be very high but it did the job. If you look at the chart I put up It stayed in comfort range that Battle Born recommended and it sealed the opening with the water proof adhesive backing facing my door vents, plus easy to install and remove.
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11 hours ago, John E Davies said:
Neat! do you have a link for the flexible insulation material you used in the outside access doors?
You might want to think about sealing off the big screened vent holes in your battery door.
Wouldn’t it be NICE if Oliver would build these trailers with molded in place fiberglass air ducts going through all those locations?
Thanks,
John Davies
Spokane WA
I think it would be great if they would harden there four season trailer by installing the additional duct work, not much extra expense and fairly easy install if it was incorporated in the manufacturing process. Due to the recent trend of switching to lithium batteries we have been reminded of the key role that temperature plays in all forms of batteries. I think if Oliver heated the battery storage compartment and kept it sealed to the inside and vented to the outside they could accommodate any battery option. Then for lithium simply install an insulating material at the opening of the compartment during the winter and remove during the summer. Plus all the other benefits of warmer bathroom and no freeze up worries with the out side wash station, water fill inlets.
To answer your question about the insulation material it was something I had on hand. The vent holes in the battery door I want to play with that during the warmer months to see if I can keep the lithium battery at the proper temperature.
As far as the outside storage compartment door which also covers the outside wash station I did not have to use any additional insulation.
I appreciate the compliment
Paul
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1 hour ago, mustang said:
I like your mud flap mod , do you have a pattern or drawing to make bracket? tks ron
I will try to make up some prints and get them posted.
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4 hours ago, John E Davies said:
Pretty. I can't tell, where is the 'fuse"? If you whack the side into a big fixed boulder while backing into a campsite, where will the bar break or bend? Will the small screws shear? What size did you choose?
Thanks.
John Davies
Spokane WA
I used two 1/4"-20 and there at the end of a 12" long bar, so I,am thinking they should shear.
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The seed was planted for this furnace mod when we grabbed a canceled reservation three weeks out at a Minnesota State Park. This reservation was mid October and when the date arrived the weather forecast had changed for the worse. We stayed for only two of the three days and we received our first snow of the season, 6 inches of wet snow. We had a non electric site and my batteries were having trouble making it through the night and I was concerned about the water freezing in the Oliver. I have already addressed switching to lithium batteries and posted about it on Oliver Forum. Now I want to share with you what I have done to relieve my worries about water freeze ups in the Oliver, provided that I have a functioning furnace.
I first tried to identify the weak spots and came up with the following.
- Boondocking Inlet
- Outside Wash Station
- Fresh Tank Fill Inlet
- City Water Inlet
- Black Tank Flush Port
- Toilet Water Supply Line
- Hot & Cold Lines Crossing Back Of Oliver
The Oliver has all of it's heat ducts run on the curbside which protect the kitchen and the bathroom faucets from freezing. My plan is to run a 2" ducting along the back to the street side and terminating in to the trough that the water lines run in for the city water inlet, fresh tank fill inlet and outside faucet. This trough also has the check valves for those two inlets and has the floor of the exterior storage compartment covering over the top of it. To get at the trough you will have to remove the back wall of the storage compartment and flip the mat back that covers the floor. This exposes the water lines that come across the back of the trailer and drop into that trough. There is a wall that separates the furnace compartment from storage and extends past the wall you just removed. It has a opening for the water lines and it is large enough to run the 2" duct through it and on top of the water lines across the back and into the trough. Now you can flip the mat back down and they are long enough to cover the water lines and the newly installed 2" duct, then the wall is put back in place.
On the connection to the furnace I removed the back of the heat exchanger. There is one hard to get at screw on the bottom but the rest are easily accessible. I made two holes, a 2" and a 4" in that back plate. I could not find a 2" starter collar locally so I bought two 4" and removed the rivets on one of them and formed a two inch collar, cut to length and re-rivet.
I then installed the 2" and 4" starter collars to the heat exchanger back panel and then the panel to the furnace. I then hooked up the 2" duct to the furnace. Looking in to the access hole under the street side bed you are able to see where the water lines come up and out of the trough and to the valve of the out side wash station. When the furnace fan is running it will blow out a lit Bic Lighter held in that area. So we're protecting water lines, the check valves and dumping warm air underneath the outside wash station valve.
Now back at the furnace I attach a 4" heavy duty aluminum foil duct to the newly installed starter collar. It is routed forward a short distance until it can be routed across the basement to the street side and then fed between the hot and cold water lines that go to the outside wash station valve. At this point I need to use a 4" coupler that is 6" long to attach the next 8' piece of 4" duct. I use the 6" long coupler so I can add holes if I need to flood a area with heat, this particular coupler did not need to. I then routed the duct from the wash station valve along the outer wall and over the wheel well, make the corner by the battery compartment and then once getting past the wheel well go down and under battery compartment. Up in that corner I attach a adhesive base 3/4" cable anchor so I can loop a 20" releasable tie strap through it and around the 4" duct holding it up and out of the way. A second 20" tie strap is used were the duct heads down under the battery compartment, it utilizes the loop that anchors the 4/0 cable coming out of the battery compartment.
Next I prep another 6" long 4" coupler by adding a metal mounting bracket. It is bolted to the coupler using two 10-24 machine screws that go through the bracket the coupler wall and then a backing plate that has tapped holes. This coupler I will add a1" hole that will be pointed up to flood heat at the battery compartment.
The mounting bracket will be utilizing the upper bolt of the support leg for the battery compartment.
This keeps the duct up and away from the inverter and electrical components and positions it to flood heat up against the bottom of the battery compartment. The next length of 4" duct is clamped to that coupler and routed up from under the battery compartment over to and along the wheel well. It is held by two 20" tie straps similar to the other side.
Because I want to run the heat duct under the foot space of the dinette I need to transition to 2" duct. There is access via the same trough that I utilized in the back of the trailer, but at the front there is more room and I am able to pull the 2" ducting through. From there it continues toward the front until it reaches the black tank flush inlet where it then follows that pipe back along the black tank and terminates by the water supply line for the toilet. At the transition point I add two more short pieces of 2" duct and route them down to where the main black tank drain pipe goes under the dinette foot space, they are terminated on either side of that pipe. There was not enough room to run the 2" duct but enough to force air along either side. At the transition from 4" to the three 2" ducts I simply inserted the three 2" into the end of the 4" and used aluminum foil duct tape to seal the transition. I also want to mention that I used the aluminum foil duct tape to reinforce the ends of every 4" duct by wrapping outside and inside before clamping.
That should cover the install, now lets talk about the results of the test in subzero weather. I rounded up seven digital thermometers and put them in the areas I was concerned about.
- Was placed just inside the empty rear storage compartment.
- Was placed on top of the batteries and a piece of acoustical insulation that was for large generator enclosure, it was 1-1/2" thick and 19" square. This was squeezed in the opening before the door was closed.
- Was placed in the rear basement curbside next to boondocking inlet.
- Was placed in the rear basement street side below the outside wash station valve.
- Was placed on the floor of the closet with the door left closed.
- Was placed on the lower shelf in the vanity in the bathroom with the door left closed.
- Was placed in front basement street side next to the black tank flush port line.
I moved it out of the heated shed at 1:00 pm on Sunday 2-7-21. I moved it back in at 3:00 pm on Tuesday 2-9-21.
The furnace was cycling off and on at -4 ' but I noticed at -8' and colder it ran continuous. I have the Truma water heater and that was also turned on. I checked propane consumption by putting on two 20 pound tanks that I had weighed and left them in place for 12 hours. It was -12' when I put them on and -2' when I took them off. Because of the subzero temperature the propane was not gasifying very well and the regulator automatically changed from the primary to the reserve after only consuming 2.353 gallons. The total consumed out of both tanks in 12 hours was 3.294 gallons, so that would be .274 gallons in one hour.
My Victron BMV-712 was telling me that I had depleted my 400 Ah Battle Born batteries to 47% and at rate of use I had two days and nine hours left.
I thought I would comment on a couple of things I like about the outcome of the project. The bathroom was comfy warm and the wall next to the bed was not icy cold.
I am not planing to take up subzero camping but it does gives me a benchmark to go off of for any situation that I might run in to. If you have any suggestions or see something that is of concern please let me know.
Paul
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I believe what you have in the picture is a outlet tester. neutral ground plug.
I bought my Oliver from a previous owner but I thought he told me Oliver supplied the neutral ground plug. Maybe you can ask Oliver if that is true.
You asked if the Honda was noticeable quieter then the Yamaha. It is.
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BATHROOM VENT OPENING WHEN ON THE ROAD
in Ollie Modifications
Posted
I noticed this happening on our last trip. My temporary fix was obviously to stuff a sock in it.
When we were back home I found that the plastic hood was deformed around the screw that mounted it to the inside handle. So this caused a small air gap around the plastic hood where it made contact to the frame. This resulted in wind getting underneath and lifting it open. The remedy was to use a heat gun and warm the plastic around the screw hole and then form it flat again. Once the plastic cooled off it stayed flat. I then added a flat piece of stainless steel as a back up plate. I did use some silicone sealant between the hood and the plate. So far it has cured the problem.