Yet another Lithium upgrade on a 2018 LE2

[KeysConchs]

Overview

We just got done upgrading our 2018 LEII (hull #344) from AGM to Lithium.  The death knell had sounded for our original AGM batteries. So, given the cost to replace the AGMs, their weight, and the limited usable capacity inherent in AGMs, we decided to upgrade to lithium.  We settled on 2, Epoch 300 Ah LiPO4 batteries with internal heating (a total of 600 Ah). The decision to purchase the Epochs was made easier by a 15% sale so we bit the bullet and purchased the batteries , a new Victron Multiplus 2 3000 VA inverter and charger, and a Victron Orion DC to DC charger which will allow us to charge directly from the tow vehicle. Here are more specific details about each step. We relied to a great extent on our tech. 

Victron Orion DC to DC charging

We mounted the 50 amp Victron Orion under the aft seat in the dinette. The Orion was set to draw 30 amps from the alternator on the 2020 Ram 1500 Ecodiesel tow vehicle. The alternator puts out about 220 amps so we are confident this is well within safe operating parameters with all existing loads.  We used 4 awg coupled to a marine connector from the TV to the trailer which looks to be quite robust.  Of course, we disconnected the power from the 7-pin connector.

Victron Multiplus 2, 3000 VA inverter and charger

We mounted the inverter vertically under the streetside bunk.  We also added a dc fan onto the bulkhead between the bunk and the basement to address heat issues and set it to operate above 40C. The inverter has a main disconnect as well as an inline breaker as per code.

System Monitoring

A Victron Multicontrol replaced the Progressive Technologies inverter switch from the OEM install and was installed in the same location. This is our primary control panel which provides operational status of the system, and allows us to control the input current. Specific battery State of Charge and other more granular data are available in the Victron shunt app, the Epoch app, and the Victron Multiplus app (as well as the original Xantrex Solar Controller which we did not change).      

Performance of the system

We tested the system today by running our OEM Dometic Penguin A/C off the battery bank.  We set the thermostat to 75 F. After 5 hours, we were at  55% SOC. Full disclosure, we only finished the install today and the tests were conducted in our winter conditions here in the Keys at 78 F ambient.  The trailer did get warm during the day, but I do think we are likely to get 5 hours or so of A/C in the hotter summer months.  Maybe even more. We haven't tested the DC to DC other than at idle. As mentioned, we set the charger to 30 amps so we are likely to get a full charge after a full day driving but that is just an estimate.  We have enough leeway to turn up the output from the alternator if needed. 

Special KUDOS

A great deal of thanks goes to our tech who helped install all this - Anthony from Outboard Rigging here in Marathon is the Man!

Pictures of the install follows: 

  

Edited Saturday at 12:18 AM by KeysConchs

[gatorewc]

Fixing to be in the same boat.   Have inquired with Oliver about the changeover.  Mind sharing the price of your cost as to what I may be looking at from an outside vendor.  The Oliver swap was to 390AH I believe.  I have sent a request to see exactly what the price covers.  Thanks for you info if possible.

[jd1923]

16 hours ago, KeysConchs said:

The trailer did get warm during the day, but I do think we are likely to get 5 hours or so of A/C in the hotter summer months.

Very nice! We have similar tastes. 😂

Your tech did a fine job too. Wondering why the 3-pin connector? Maybe one lead is just a blank. It looks solid though, easy to connect and a clean install. The Victron suggested vertical installation is not possible in the Oliver. Yours is horizontal like the rest of ours and the fan is a necessity in the South or SW.

Do you have the 13.5 or 11K BTU Penguin? You may want to get the 15K BTU Atmos A/C with heat pump, which at 10A uses about 60% AH of the 13.5K P2. I plan to install one this spring to run the air longer and not hear that loud noise anymore.

The problem with consuming for example 50% SOC (300AH) running the A/C is the recharging takes much longer. Two hours towing at 30A DC-DC will only increase SOC by 10%. A long day on the road, a sunny Florida day with solar and the charge rate would increase. Did your hull have solar already?

@gatorewc your name reads like you live in Florida too, where small solar companies are everywhere. The price should certainly be lower, much lower without travel, and you cannot get the preferred Victron products and less expensive, greater capacity Epoch batteries from OTT (Xantrex with Lithionics).

I also purchased the Orion XS 50A DC-DC charger, 4 AWG cable with Anderson connectors. Mine is still on the workbench, to be installed this month!

@KeysConchs I know you will enjoy your new Victron inverter/charger system. Bravo!

https://olivertraveltrailers.com/forums/topic/10420-off-grid-upgrade-minimal-design-–-victron-multiplus-ii-and-600ah-epoch-lifepo4/#comment-112871

[KeysConchs]

 

7 hours ago, jd1923 said:

Very nice! We have similar tastes. 😂

Your tech did a fine job too. Wondering why the 3-pin connector? Maybe one lead is just a blank. It looks solid though, easy to connect and a clean install. The Victron suggested vertical installation is not possible in the Oliver. Yours is horizontal like the rest of ours and the fan is a necessity in the South or SW.

Do you have the 13.5 or 11K BTU Penguin? You may want to get the 15K BTU Atmos A/C with heat pump, which at 10A uses about 60% AH of the 13.5K P2. I plan to install one this spring to run the air longer and not hear that loud noise anymore.

The problem with consuming for example 50% SOC (300AH) running the A/C is the recharging takes much longer. Two hours towing at 30A DC-DC will only increase SOC by 10%. A long day on the road, a sunny Florida day with solar and the charge rate would increase. Did your hull have solar already?

@gatorewc your name reads like you live in Florida too, where small solar companies are everywhere. The price should certainly be lower, much lower without travel, and you cannot get the preferred Victron products and less expensive, greater capacity Epoch batteries from OTT (Xantrex with Lithionics).

I also purchased the Orion XS 50A DC-DC charger, 4 AWG cable with Anderson connectors. Mine is still on the workbench, to be installed this month!

@KeysConchs I know you will enjoy your new Victron inverter/charger system. Bravo!

https://olivertraveltrailers.com/forums/topic/10420-off-grid-upgrade-minimal-design-–-victron-multiplus-ii-and-600ah-epoch-lifepo4/#comment-112871

Hello JD.  We have the 13,500 BTU Dometic Penguin. Neither my wife nor I are too bothered by the noise unlike many others. And yes, we do have the solar package. We were drawing roughly 150-160 amps with the a/c running (see screenshot below).  We are looking at alternative a/c options, but at this point, we have already spent a great deal on the LiFePO4 system.  And, we are about to upgrade the shocks - we just received our Bulldogs and are cautiously pessimistic as we note that they are made in China.  Hoping our leaf springs last a while longer. So, our major upgrade is complete, but there are more to come.  With regards to dc2dc charging, we are considering a 400 w suitcase to add to the rooftop capacity and we can boost the output from the alternator above the 30 amps it is set at.  Math tells us we will be short, but empirical testing will provide more insightful info.         

To answer your other question: only two of the 3 pins are connected and functional.  We were wondering why they had 3 pins and all we could come up with is that it is for stability and reduces flex.     

Note that each battery is drawing about 79 amps. BUT, we had our 3-way Dometic absorption fridge on DC - this consumes  a whopping 15 amps on its own.

Edited yesterday at 12:39 AM by KeysConchs

[KeysConchs]

4 hours ago, gatorewc said:

Fixing to be in the same boat.   Have inquired with Oliver about the changeover.  Mind sharing the price of your cost as to what I may be looking at from an outside vendor.  The Oliver swap was to 390AH I believe.  I have sent a request to see exactly what the price covers.  Thanks for you info if possible.

Hello gatorewc

Our total cost for the system was $6,568 which includes the 2 Epoch 300 Ah batteries, the Victron Multiplus 2 inverter, the Orion 50 amp DC to DC charger, the Victron Multicontrol, and a variety of fuses, dongles, cable, switches, connectors, and other miscellaneous parts and supplies.  Labor was about $2,200 of that.  Given that replacing the Trojan T-105 AGMs would cost about $900 for all 4, we decided to bite the bullet.

Edited Saturday at 08:51 PM by KeysConchs

[jd1923]

20 hours ago, KeysConchs said:

We are looking at alternative a/c options, but at this point, we have already spent a great deal on the LiFePO4 system.

I certainly understand! Good thing we found an older hull used at about half  the cost of a well-equipped new one! Since June 2023 I have added $12K in maintenance and upgrades, parts cost only with my labor.

I believe your price was quite fair. Not sure what OTT charges for their 390AH package, but it’s not 600A! Also, it does not include a DC-DC charger. OTT advertised one on sale recently, where they would install the lesser model, the older bulky 30A Victron charger on the Oliver side only (TV cabling and install on you). I calculated they had near $1000 for labor alone (for half the installation). Your installer spent a lot of hours installing your complete system. I know what is entailed here.

Your 153A reading at 13.1V translates to 16.7A on 120VAC (153 x 13.1 / 120). Given the Atmos will cool well using 10A on 120VAC it should consume 60% as many AHs! (or last 67% longer on equal AHs). I cannot stand the NOISE of the P2!

After I install our Victron Orion XS 50A system (parts paid for), I have the Atmos and a Starlink mini on my list (as we can afford them)!

Best wishes and again enjoy! 😂

[gatorewc]

the price we were quoted was $5600 but I am asking exactly what will be replaced.  $1000 more for 210 more AH seems very reasonable.   I wish I could do it myself but 2 fake knees and lack of knowledge ..... I know my limits.   Is the company available for similar installation or was this a friend quote?  Thanks for any information