John E Davies

I feel that I can't say too much in this thread since I do not yet own an Oliver. However, I love the concept of pure "back country self-sufficiency". Both of the locations in your pictures would suit me perfectly ..... IF there were no other campers besides yours own. Or certainly, none within sight or sound. I am interested to hear from Oliver owners about this. Maybe I will be able to contribute my own comments by next summer. John Davies Spokane WA

Nice work, that looks simply great. Has anyone seen any signs of water damage to the gearbox/ motors on these front units? What is the suggested service interval for lubing the gears, and what kind of grease is used? Would it be beneficial to make a slip on weatherproof cover for storage? That would help to prevent damage to the finish as well as cracking/ degradation of the flexible switch boots due to UV exposure. I assume the inside jacks are much less of a concern since they are well protected. Thanks. John Davies Spokane WA

So, what is the current incentive $ amount for showing your trailer to somebody who subsequently orders one? How does it work if a new customer views more than one Ollie? For example, my wife and I viewed both King and Twin versions of the Elite II at different times and locations. Will Oliver keep an Ollie owner supplied with brochures to hand out when he gets flagged down and stopped, and that person demands an impromptu showing? I have heard that this event is not uncommon. LOL. Thanks. John Davies Spokane WA

The manufacturer does not recommend using the Trailer Valet with a coupler as tall as the Ollie's: "Thank You for your interest in Trailer Valet. Our engineer reviewed your email and suggests that our product could be dangerous for your application. Check back in 2017 and see what we're offering next!" That is both discouraging and encouraging. I have no clue what that last statement means. John Davies Spokane WA

John, Your truck is a serious pulling machine and with new shocks you won't even feel an Oliver back there without a WD hitch. You can always add one later if you feel you must - it simply bolts on. I think your rig has a tow rating over 13,000 pounds. https://www.guaranteerv.com/upload/Tow%20Ratings/1999.pdf My 2006 Ram 3500 Quad Cab Cummins is a similar size and will tow over 14K. I haven't towed an RV behind yet, it but it sure doesn't feel 6500 pounds of car and car hauler, even on steep grades or choppy pavement. The problem you will have is soot buildup on the pretty white shell of the Oliver. Are you prepared to deal with that nagging worry? It will be a constant irritation. The 7.3 is a fantastic engine but as you know, it sends plenty of greasy soot out the tailpipe. Your truck has a lot of resale value and for this reason alone you might want to trade it for a cleaner running TV. The new 2017 F150 3.5L Eco Boost with upgraded drive train sure has me interested. Or maybe even a Raptor..... But both of those would absolutely require the Anderson hitch. John Davies Spokane WA

When boondocking you need to focus on the casual larcenous passerby - the drunken hunter, the bored country guys out for a drive, the young stud aiming to show off to his girlfriend.... You are never going to see professional car thieves cruising the back country. In this scenario, several layers of protection are probably the best approach. But they need to be very (blatantly) obvious. Consider a brightly painted hitch lock, hanging a red streamer on a cabled wheel, etc. The idea is to make that idiot look at those layers for 30 seconds and quickly decide that it just isn't worth the bother. Especially when a completely unsecured rig may be right around the next bend in the road. The location you need to be really concerned about is an urban storage lot, where a thief might show up with a box-truck full of metal cutting tools, three strong friends, chains and winch. There is nothing in the world you can do to stop somebody like that, if they really want your trailer. Modern battery powered cutting tools will go through any lock in less than a minute. Bolt cutters are even faster and are dead silent. The "security system" for most storage lots is pretty much meaningless.... http://jalopnik.com/thieves-steal-wheels-from-48-dealership-cars-in-just-fo-1785764601 I have never heard of those one-way locknuts. They seem interesting, until you need to remove them one day. Then you will have to torch or saw them off. Layers and layers..... and stay vigilant. Keeping your Ollie completely out of sight during long term storage is the best approach, but that won't work in the woods, unless you can find a really hidden campsite that is not visible from the road. John Davies Spokane WA

Bob, I fixed your link. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0090C4VFE/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pC_S_ttl?_encoding=UTF8&colid=1CVIH2BOJVEI3&coliid=I20WGFDQN8KTZ8&psc=1 I like the Master Python cable lock. The basic one is only 3/8 inch x 6 feet but you can get really long version, up to 30 feet, and you can draw it up tight to eliminate slack. By keeping it off the ground it is much harder to cut. The extra length lets you use it for securing other gear besides the trailer, like bikes or kayaks. https://www.amazon.com/Master-Lock-Python-Adjustable-8413-30/dp/B004VZ1UDG/ref=sr_1_2?s=hi&ie=UTF8&qid=1473129620&sr=1-2&keywords=Master+Python+lock+long+cable I have had the 16 footer for many years and it has been most useful. John Davies Spokane WA

Buzzy ... Back off your nuts (that sounds bad, doesn't it?) connect each shackle to the next available chain link, readjust and try it out. It is apparent that you need to eliminate a little slack in your system. If this works you can just leave those links dangling or borrow a bolt cutter to whack them off. If you have any threads left in front of the nuts you could just crank the nuts another turn using a big adjustable wrench, if you have one, for testing purposes. If there are no threads left then you gotta shorten the chains a bit. Take baby steps and keep things reversable in case it doesn't help. John Davies Spokane WA

I have no Oliver yet, I am working on that situation. ;) My mistake, I thought it was available for the WD hitch, but I was wrong. They make regular threaded balls as well as ones with a smooth straight shaft for their switchable ball mount, using the same type of top coating, sleeve, top hat, cap, whatever you want to call it. I am sure it quiets and lubricates, but IMHO that benefit would only be for a "like new" coupler in a clean environment. Add some pitting and flaking inside the coupler socket, and grit and water from a run down an unimproved road, and you will have a real mess on your hands. I think! Which is why I am trying to see how they hold up in the long run. My gut feeling is that they are a gimmick. Since it isn't available for the WD hitch maybe I should just go away now.... John Davies Spokane WA

Does anyone know how much the bare "hulls" of an Elite II weigh after the openings have been cut? Oliver uses hand laid fiberglass cloth and mat (instead of a typical chopper gun which shoots a mix of loose fibers and resin), which is an excellent feature. However FG construction is very heavy compared to newer composites like kevlar. Many of the high end canoe and kayak companies have completely abandoned construction using 100% fiberglass because it is just so darned heavy. Wenonah hasn't made a pure fiberglass hull in decades.... It does have advantages in lower material cost, easy repair and much better impact resistance, but kevlar and carbon fiber offer PHENOMINAL weight savings. Labor costs are very similar. A canoe that weighs 75 pounds in fiberglass might weigh less than 40 pounds in kevlar. That is a very substantial reduction. I wonder if we might see more use of newer fibers in Ollies in the future. The outer hull halves would need to have fiberglass in their outer layers to provide good protection from impact damage, and to make repairs easy, but the inside hull and cabinets could be made almost entirely of CF. I imagine the weight could be reduced by 500 or more pounds easily. If we knew the hull weight, we could predict the weight savings fairly accurately. http://www.christinedemerchant.com/carbon-kevlar-glass-comparison.html Offer a "Carbon Appearance Package" and use a bare CF layer for all the interior surfaces. How cool looking and light weight would that be? I would check a box for carbon fiber countertops in a heartbeat, instead of faux granite... Costs are coming down: http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2014/03/carbon-fiber-car-part-costs-drop-dramatically.html The hull cost would obviously be significantly higher (but not outrageously so) but the benefits would be extremely substantial. More and more people are looking for super light trailers. For those of us towing with full sized turbo diesels it would not be an attractive option.... This type of construction would really anchor Oliver's position as a top tier RV manufacturer. Comments? Buzzy, you are intimately associated with kayaks, can you chime in here? John Davies Spokane WA

Unlike your typical stick and staple trailer that has a lifespan of twenty years at best, and that may only see a few thousand miles of use in its lifetime, Olivers are expensive "heritage trailers", designed and intended to pass on to future generations. Other than the poor standard Dexter suspension, they are intended to go many, many miles and last fifty years. Any owner that does not try to eliminate wear and tear of his $60,000 trailer by simple precautions such as lubing the coupler should be prepared to replace the parts when they inevitably get nasty. Steel on steel movement under high loads without any lube is always very bad news, regardless of the application. But you are indeed correct: in the end the end user decides, always. But don't think for a second that a ball will outlast an Oliver. Do you care to answer my questions about the greaseless hitch ball? Thanks for your participation. Please do not take my disagreement as anything but constructive. I think Anderson offers a superior product, and I wish more manufacturers participated here. John Davies Spokane WA

Ran across this page by chance. It is excellent and chock full of great information. Some of the pics are scary because it is focussed on (rusty) boat trailers, but the info is solid and very complete. http://www.leeroysramblings.com/Boat%20Trailer_brakes.htm John Davies Spokane WA

Sage, no offense, but you misrepresent what I said. I indicated that grease was a good idea (in fact I would never tow without grease on any heavily loaded hitch ball). You imply that it isn't needed at all. These are two different positions entirely. Once the chrome wears off the ball, and the paint off the coupler, you will get corrosion and it _will_ wreck the parts, sooner or later. Harsh conditions (road chemicals, dust, water) hasten things. Perhaps you are referring to the Anderson greaseless hitch ball? Correct me if I am wrong, but that unit doesn't come standard with the WD hitch. I would be happy using one of those without any lube in a clean towing environment. How do those hold up in the long run? Do they get damaged by old worn couplers? Can you please comment? John Davies Spokane WA

Keep in mind that even tho the entire ball assembly rotates during turns, the coupler is still going to rotate up and down on the ball as you drive over dips or bumps. I think grease is always appropriate for any heavy tongue load. A little utility trailer? No need for lube at all. If the ball and coupler rust, then you get serious, rapidly escalating damage to both parts. It's best to keep them slick and rust free, always. It does make for swearing when you get dirty grease on your pants leg, plus you need to remember to wipe out the old yucky grease from the coupler every so often. John Davies Spokane WA

I emailed Anderson with this question a few months ago and never received a reply. How does the hitch do in continual heavy dust? Does the friction insert get damaged or become sticky in its movement? I drive on north Idaho National Forest dirt roads and in the summer they can be extremely dusty. Thanks. John Davies Spokane WA

Seems as if this trucklet would make a good tow vehicle for either Oliver model, tho personally I would choose more power for towing the Elite II due to challenging terrain and high altitudes here in the West. http://news.pickuptrucks.com/2016/08/2016-gmc-canyon-diesel-tows-camps-like-a-champ.html John Davies Spokane WA

OK, this crash test video from Scandinavia is very disturbing. It just popped up on Jalopnik this morning. Notice all the gear flying forward to kill the occupants. At least the dummies "died" instantaneously. I am very aware of this hazard and (try to) use a cargo barrier in an SUV or wagon. The Aussies are very strung up about proper cargo containment - Milford offers super strong steel barriers for most common vehicles, but good ones designed to stop a flying toolbox (not a 20 pound terrier) are almost impossible to find in the USA. I find this to be strange.... Notice the kayak launching forward like a huge spear. It slides right out of the rear strap and rips the entire front crossbar completely off the roof of the car. http://sploid.gizmodo.com/disturbing-crash-test-footage-shows-why-you-should-stra-1785993523 This is the scenario I had in my mind when considering a stern tie down. Maybe, just maybe, a stout strap at the back, going to the rear bumper, would stop the boat from going into Warp 6 in the event of a collision.. EDIT: I used a convenient online converter to figure the kinetic energy of a flying canoe: 80 pounds (I added the weight of the front crossbar) moving at 65 mph is 11,300 foot pounds. (Tho it would probably slow down a little while ripping off the rack.) This is way more than even a humongous .700 Nitro Express big game cartridge. Your typical .308 bullet delivers about 2700 ft lbs. I would much rather be shot by the .308 than be hit by a 65 mph canoe.... Looking at those figures it is obvious to me that there is NO way to keep the boat on the roof in a collision at freeway speeds - even if you used steel cables the hull would come apart. I guess all we can plan for is the survivable ones that occur at less than 30 mph.... and try to slow down the speed of the departing boat. John Davies Spokane WA

It has been working brilliantly for me, the best it ever has! This is with an iMac and iPad, both running Safari. I am seeing a consistent five or six second lag between posting and seeing the entire new page. No complaints about that. John Davies Spokane WA

I like that device, it is elegant and simple. At around 19 inches to the top of the ball (no load) is a little short to work with an Oliver with it's nearly 2 foot coupler height, perhaps. It will surely settle quite a bit under heavy load. eTrailer has a bunch of answered questions here: https://www.etrailer.com/Hitch-Accessories/Trailer-Valet/TVXL2.html This video from that page is great: https://images.etrailer.com/static/images/video/review-trailer-valet-xl-trailer-dolly-tvxl25_web.mp4 The $580 price isn't too bad for what looks like a high quality piece of equipment. On even the slightest slope I would still like to have a second person nearby with a set of chocks in case it got away from me..... https://www.trailervalet.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/xlmanual-en.pdf BTW the operating manual says to NOT use it on any kind of grade. I sent an email to the manufacturer asking if it can work with a tall coupler like on the Oliver. John Davies Spokane WA

Buzzy, thanks for the info. I thought the rear tie down was in case of a collision, and had not considered it to be a last resort safety device to stop the canoe from flying completely backwards. I guess I need to re-engineer my bow and stern tie downs. I have 1 inch nylon tie down straps simply looped around the front and rear aluminum gunwale braces (I don't know the correct term). I am not sure that two soft aluminum rivets holding each brace would take the force of an airborne boat without shearing completely. Should I drill the hull at both ends and install strong loops through the boat structure? I don't ever plan to line the boat through white water, but it would be nice to be able to secure it with a cable lock. Do you recommend this product? http://www.tugeye.com I do value your advice, I am a level headed person but never had any training about boats. When I started out there simply wasn't much easily accessible info, except for the Boy Scouts which I never joined. It was an information wasteland back then ;) John Davies Spokane WA

I don't think I would like a site within 1/4 mile of her.... She should be using electric saws! However I am a big Stihl fan, so maybe I would give her a little slack. . . Nah! Are there no rules about commercial activity and disturbing the peace? John Davies Spokane WA

The website was down for maintenance today but it is back and now it has a rather snappy response. Hooray! I hope it stays fixed. John Davies Spokane WA

That is interesting, I had not even heard of that device before. I think it might be a viable option for you, but the warnings at the beginning of the installation instructions are sobering. They do not recommend driving on rough roads. That kills it for me.... https://www.usrack.com/instructions/v_rack_instructions.pdf With a canopy installed I would have to completely unhook that device before getting into the bed. That is not good, in any way. BTW to insert a clickable link you must use the toolbar button - click the third button from the right, paste your copied url into the box that pops up, then click the white arrow to insert the link into your post. One critical thing to understand about body on frame trucks is that the bed moves independently from the cab as you get on really uneven surfaces. If your canoe is secured hard at the bed and also at,the roof of the cab, you will subject the hull to severe wracking forces that are not good for it! You can have an extra support at the back, but it should be supporting the pointy part and not across the gunwales. If the support rotates under the pointed stern with a bungee cord that has some give, it will not wrack the hull. Does that make any sense? http://blog.caranddriver.com/chevrolet-rolls-its-own-silverado-hd-vs-ford-f-250-in-pickup-flex-fest-video/ BTW frame flex is NOT necessarily bad .... It give the truck extra suspension articulation off pavement, which keeps you from getting stuck, maybe. The Ford in the pic is much better offroad than the Chevy, because it can keep its tires better planted on the ground. The flip side is that you would destroy a canoe strapped down to a bumper rack and the cab on the Ford. Maybe not in the Chevy. I think either a complete cab rack, or a complete bed/ canopy rack is best, but not a combination of the two. Unless you never venture off pavement. I don't know how your tonneau mounts to the rails, but is there any way you could re-engineer it to mount a bed rack something like this? The rack alone is about $300. http://shop.agricover.com/product/loradoandadarac I think that is what you should be aiming for. You can stand on the bed or the open gate to secure the load and it in no way limits access, nor does it wrack the boat. Plus it is way cool looking, which is always a plus. The side rails mount permanently into the stake pockets, but the vertical bars can be removed with hand tools. John Davies Spokane

Buzzy, thanks for the comments. My main concern about my Q Towers is the really unsecure way they attach to the rain gutters, OVER the squishy rubber. They just don't feel like they will stay on the truck. They will certainly damage the rubber, eventually. It just feels like a shade tree design to me. I don't have any trouble lifting overhead, and my wife is there to help. The problem is that the canoe is most easily lifted upside down, and the approach angle from the side is darned awkward, even with the Boat Loader extended, and I feel that I may damage the truck. Once it is up onto the crossbars, I have no trouble securing it. It would be very awkward to put the canoe up top right side up, then flip it. It is just too darned high. The canoe has a 35 inch beam, so flipping on the roof requires a lot of struggling. I think loading from the very back, with the tailgate for a standing platform, will work out best, if I can get my canopy beefed up enough to accept some long rack rails. I already have a trailer that the canoe can ride on, but that is not an option for when I in finally get an Oliver. I am trying to figure out this scenario while I have time to experiment. BTW the canoe is an old Sundowner 17 Tuff-Weave, but it still paddles great. I may sell it off in a year and buy a new canoe in Kevlar (39 lbs) that is not beat to heck on the bottom. I used to have a lovely Wenonah Jensen 18 (with a low, skinny semi-racing flat water hull) and really enjoyed it, but that would be too risky for this older body. At 64 my balance is not so good now. This one is more forgiving and I have only dumped it once, so far. When I get the two labradoodles into it, I think that will happen more often. I am going to try a set of stabilizers for that! Question: Am I worrying too much about a stern line? I need a bow line because the canoe rides inverted and a huge amount of wind goes up and under the bow, trying to peel it back off the roof. I guess the stern line would help to keep the boat from exiting forward in the event of a collision, but otherwise would not do much else. Correct? I am using Yakima gunwale brackets, which keep the canoe pretty well anchored fore and aft. John Davies Spokane WA

Randy, I was considering the version of the rack in that picture that goes outside the canopy, carrying the load straight down to the bed rails. It would probably be $2000 after shipping. I could get a Leer canopy with the factory installed rails but that would be even more. I may just do major surgery on my regular canopy, by opening up the headliner and bonding a couple of 4 inch x 1/8 inch x 72 inch aluminum plates to the underside of the fiberglass, to distribute the load from a pair of aluminum roof rack rails. John Davies Spokane WA