Isotherm Refrigerator - What are we doing wrong?

[DunnYet]

New to us Oliver Legacy Elite II (2023) Hull #1364. Have spent the weekend in the Texas Hlll Country updating my knowledge of Oliver systems from our two year journey with LE I Hull #1030 (2022). Only two problems so far. Giving each issue it’s own topic for future search help.

In this topic - our problems with the Isothem fridge. We can’t keep it in the safe zone consistently. We have SensorPush sensors in the main compartment as well as the freezer - the freezer seems to work great but the fridge hovers at the top of the safe zone for much of the day. Recovery after opening the door also seems to take longer than our old tri-fuel fridge.

Here is the full scenario:

(1) Shore power 30 Amp all tests good. No issues with any other systems (AC/ lighting / etc)

(2) We have a fridge fan that we moved over from our LE I tri fuel. It’s located in the center of the fridge space and operating correctly.

(3) Weekend food load - not a lot but not empty.

(4) Confirmed that the vent cover is in place on the exterior vent opening.

Have read everything I can find searching the forums. It does not appear that the previous owners did any extra insulation on the exterior wall, should I get some reflective blanket material and put that in covering from the upper vent to the lower access panel? Fins and back side of the fridge look clean, so I don’t think there is an issue with buildup on the coils.

Appreciate any advice on how to improve the operation on the fridge. I don’t want to have to haul a backup fridge if I don’t need to.

[jd1923]

29 minutes ago, DunnYet said:

We have a fridge fan that we moved over from our LE I tri fuel. It’s located in the center of the fridge space and operating correctly.

Try running without this fan. Could be it's upsetting the internal ofridge thermostat. We have the older 3-way and performs well as-is. 

[DunnYet]

Posting some additional information in hopes of getting this to be more than a decent wine fridge for red wine. As a reminder- Hull 1634 2023 LE II - New to us.

From when we left Saturday to tonight, the fridge has never reached what we would consider a "food safe temp" Using a Sensor Push sensor located in the middle of the fridge compartment the lowest temp we have recorded is 40.2 degrees F. Most of the time it's in the high 40's. 

The freezer - small as it is - works great. Keeps two trays of ice cubes solid. 

Tonight, we don't have the A/C running, so I have been listening for the compressor to cycle. It rarely comes on. If you open the door it will run for about 30 seconds, then stop. It will cycle intermittently; however it never seems to stay on for very long. 

Reading the troubleshooting guide the following things seem to match the symptoms for loss of refrigerant or insufficient ventilation. Everything I have read on the forums says to leave the vent block in the upper vent, so I have. I can't see any obstructions in the internal upper vents. 

Could this be a thermostat? Something where the fridge "thinks" it's at the proper temperature even though it's in the upper 40's? What temp should I expect when the dial is all the way over at 7? Do I need a "Spinal Tap" dial that goes up to "11"?

We don't carry enough wine just to use it to chill down red wine and put a little chill on shelf stable products. That's what we are using if for on this trip. Any suggestions greatly appreciated.

Keivn

 

 

 

[jd1923]

We're home now but I ran ours overnight just to see. I only put a gallon of water in the bottom, and nothing in the freezer. I placed two RUUVi sensors, one in a basket in the freezer and another on the center shelf in the fridge. They read 12 and 47 F the next morning. Maybe this is common with RV fridges, and most people do not notice. Though my test was not valid without food and running longer. We traveled 3 weeks Apr-May, and it got water bottles pretty cold during the day while we were out and certainly cold when left overnight. Thanks for bringing this to my attention. I will measure temps next time out.

Given you're still traveling and need a quick fix...
Not being familiar with the Isotherm, does it have a small freezer in the top of the fridge like most models? What if you remove the freezer compartment door? And maybe the door shelf in front of it. The cool would sink to the bottom and the warmth from below would rise and perhaps signal the thermostat to keep the compressor running longer. You would lose a freezer but perhaps get a colder fridge. It might be worth a try, and you could always reinstall the parts later.

[topgun2]

Have you tried one of THESE fridge fans?

I've used one of these for years due to the fact that our RV fridges are subject to a bunch of factors that simply are not present with our fridges at home.  The fan helps to more evenly distribute the air and, thus, evens out the temps throughout the fridge.

Bill

[DunnYet]

37 minutes ago, topgun2 said:

Have you tried one of THESE fridge fans?

That’s the exact one we have. We purchased it for the Tri-Fuel fridge and moved it to the LE II Isotherm compressor fridge. It helped greatly in the tri-Fuel.

[SeaDawg]

@jd1923, the op reports that he has an isotherm/dc danfoss compressor fridge. 2016s like yours had 3ways as original equipment.  Have ypu upgraded yours?

@DunnYet, we've never used a fan in our truckfridge (similar to your isotherm. Same interior, same compressor.) Try without it. Your isotherm vents to the interior of the trailer, not exterior. Is anything blocking interior venting? Any ice buildup in the shoebox freezer?

[jd1923]

@SeaDawg yes, we have the old style. I mentioned removing the add-on fan in an earlier post. @DunnYet, we have not heard back re what you may have tried? @topgun2 the fan you showed is what we suggested in removing such device.

I like a fridge that runs on propane and will likely keep ours for a while. The freezer is large (I read the Isotherm freezer is teeny and that it has cycling issues on many online forums). It fits two of our jumbo ice cube trays, large cubes for special drinks, and it cools a new tray down every night. 😂 

Edited July 3 by jd1923
shortened

[DunnYet]

5 hours ago, SeaDawg said:

Your isotherm vents to the interior of the trailer, not exterior. Is anything blocking interior venting? Any ice buildup in the shoebox freezer?

No obstructions in the interior vent - I took out the external vent cover and could see clearly into the interior of the trailer. There is a small amount of frost in the interior freezer, but not so much that we cannot get the ice cube trays in and out.

6 hours ago, SeaDawg said:

we've never used a fan in our truckfridge (similar to your isotherm. Same interior, same compressor.)

The interior fan is just to circulate the air inside the refrigerator compartment - to keep the temp at a common level. Reduces air stratification where the cold air ends up at the bottom and the warmer air at the top. We did the first couple of days in the driveway without it and the temps where less stable. However, in the interest of science wil pull it out over the next day and see what happens

20 hours ago, jd1923 said:

Not being familiar with the Isotherm, does it have a small freezer in the top of the fridge like most models? What if you remove the freezer compartment door? And maybe the door shelf in front of it. The cool would sink to the bottom and the warmth from below would rise and perhaps signal the thermostat to keep the compressor running longer. You would lose a freezer but perhaps get a colder fridge. It might be worth a try, and you could always reinstall the parts later.

Yes to small freezer - two ice cube trays is it. The freezer works great, it's just useless for any food.

Given the other posts on the forum about breaking off the tabs, I don't want Rebecca to be even more annoyed with me and the trailer fridge by breaking the tabs while removing the door. Will try this in a safe space between trips.

1 hour ago, jd1923 said:

I like a fridge that runs on propane and will likely keep ours for a while. The freezer is large (I read the Isotherm freezer is teeny and that it has cycling issues on many online forums). It fits two of our jumbo ice cube trays, large cubes for special drinks, and it cools a new tray down every night. 😂 

The tri fuel fridge is the thing we miss most about the LE I Hull #1030. Well, that and the ability to park in two parking spaces in a parking lot. Finding a place to park in downtown Durango today was an experience....

-----

Now - for updates from the road. We traveled from northern NM to north of Durango today, with the ambient dropping into the 70s for the last half of the day. The fridge performed better in the lower ambient temps. While traveling through NM the interior of the trailer (also being monitored with a sensor push sensor mounted above the bathroom door) was pretty much in the low 90's. Once into elevation in Colorado it dropped to the low 80's. Could this just be a design capacity issue? If it's venting into an interior that's already 90 degrees, is that causing a lack of cooling?

Also - could I be picking up extra heat being transmitted through the exterior shell into the refrigerator compartment? High winds everywhere we have camped this trip have prevented the use of the awning, so no shade on the curb side of the trailer when stopped. Unfortunately, I don't have an extra sensor push sensor to monitor the compartment temp behind the fridge. Would some type of reflective barrier over the inside of the exterior wall help?

[jd1923]

3 hours ago, DunnYet said:

with the ambient dropping into the 70s for the last half of the day. The fridge performed better in the lower ambient temps.

This is informative and I get it about the freezer door. I believe I remember reading a post from @HDRider about replacing a broken door hinge.

This is what @SeaDawg was pointing to. If your airflow is limited it could act this way. If you find your Isotherm fridge works well at elevation and cool nights, then the fridge is likely OK. Very good work! When you get home, maybe add a cooling fan like others have mentioned on our forum.

My older hull has an OEM external fan and ON/OFF switch (see pic). Never seen a switch label like this in another RV.

Edited July 3 by jd1923
Added last sentence

[John Dorrer]

On 6/22/2024 at 10:40 PM, DunnYet said:

New to us Oliver Legacy Elite II (2023) Hull #1364. Have spent the weekend in the Texas Hlll Country updating my knowledge of Oliver systems from our two year journey with LE I Hull #1030 (2022). Only two problems so far. Giving each issue it’s own topic for future search help.

In this topic - our problems with the Isothem fridge. We can’t keep it in the safe zone consistently. We have SensorPush sensors in the main compartment as well as the freezer - the freezer seems to work great but the fridge hovers at the top of the safe zone for much of the day. Recovery after opening the door also seems to take longer than our old tri-fuel fridge.

Here is the full scenario:

(1) Shore power 30 Amp all tests good. No issues with any other systems (AC/ lighting / etc)

(2) We have a fridge fan that we moved over from our LE I tri fuel. It’s located in the center of the fridge space and operating correctly.

(3) Weekend food load - not a lot but not empty.

(4) Confirmed that the vent cover is in place on the exterior vent opening.

Have read everything I can find searching the forums. It does not appear that the previous owners did any extra insulation on the exterior wall, should I get some reflective blanket material and put that in covering from the upper vent to the lower access panel? Fins and back side of the fridge look clean, so I don’t think there is an issue with buildup on the coils.

Appreciate any advice on how to improve the operation on the fridge. I don’t want to have to haul a backup fridge if I don’t need to.

There are 2 issues. First when you open the door, the cold drops out. You learn to know what you need, open, grab, and close,🙃 Fact of life. The small fan will be a benefit in either a compressor fridge or absorbsion fridge. It circulates air in the fridge, and will have "Zero" negative affect. 

In our truck camper, we built a shade to provide shade over the 2 vents. 2023 LE2 has one (1) vent and the 2024 LE2 has none as it vents to the interior. Earlier models have the absorbsion fridge and 2 vents. 

 

Suggest that you add 2 computer fans behind the upper vent screen if you have a LE2 2023 or earlier. Someone will have to assist with how to wire.

 

The fan I installed in our truck camper behind the upper vent, along with the battery operated fan in the fridge made a huge difference. One learns to park to lessen the sum exposure to the curb side of the trailer. A shade over the vents all will help.

 

Edited July 5 by John Dorrer
typo

[DunnYet]

16 minutes ago, John Dorrer said:

Suggest that you add 2 computer fans behind the upper vent screen if you have a LE2 2023 or earlier. Someone will have to assist with how to wire.

Great suggestions John - When you are talking vents are you referring to the internal vs external vents? 

We do have the 2023 with the single upper external vent - however when we got it from the previous owners it had a blocking cover installed in the external vent. It's not an airtight block by any means.

Photo of external vent and vent cover.

 

The internal vent is open to the inside -and is unobstructed as shown in the photo from the exterior with the vent cover and blocking cover removed.

Inside view.

[John Dorrer]

24 minutes ago, DunnYet said:

Great suggestions John - When you are talking vents are you referring to the internal vs external vents? 

We do have the 2023 with the single upper external vent - however when we got it from the previous owners it had a blocking cover installed in the external vent. It's not an airtight block by any means.

Photo of external vent and vent cover.

 

The internal vent is open to the inside -and is unobstructed as shown in the photo from the exterior with the vent cover and blocking cover removed.

Inside view.

Our upper vent (2022 LE2) had a slot and a mobile RV guy said it should be sealed and he fixed it, and I confirmed with Oliver. The fan would be installed right on the backside of the Oliver cover. Don't have our trailer at home, so I can't check it. If you only have one awning, there is a switch for a street side awning that could be used for the fan (s).

 

[DunnYet]

14 minutes ago, John Dorrer said:

Our upper vent (2022 LE2) had a slot and a mobile RV guy said it should be sealed and he fixed it, and I confirmed with Oliver. The fan would be installed right on the backside of the Oliver cover.

So  ...seal the interior slot above the fridge, remove the blocking cover, and fan force out vent through the exterior vent.

Sounds like a do-able project. We have both awnings so will come up with a different switch placement. May just put a switch through the (to be blocked) vents above the fridge, that way we can turn it on when we turn on the fridge and turn it off when doing the shutdown process.

Thanks very much!!

[SeaDawg]

 In our retrofit install of the tf130, we sealed both vents. (We had both.) We added insulation to the vents, and the sides of the cavity, still leaving an airgap around the fridge. Made sure we had more than 24 square inches of venting, to the interior. No more screening necessary to keep mud daubers out.

We've never had an overtemp issue in ours. Normally run the fridge on 5 or so. But, we don't camp in 95 or 100+ degree weather, either. I leave that to younger, more heat tolerant folks.

We do keep plenty of cold sink foods/beverages in the fridge. All fridges seem to work better when loaded, vs empty/lightly loaded. 

As someone else suggested, all the cold comes from the tiny freezer. I think the temp sensor is within the wall of the freezer, as well. There are some air slots at the back. Maybe move your fan from center to left, and try to draw more cool air from the freezer? You could also have a faulty thermostat. 

Isotherm sells a kit which includes a sensor in the fridge cavity, as well. Many boater use it. I think Overland installed it for his, maybe. I'll see what I find.

The other suggestions of shading the fridge side are good. 

Wondering if you have a true 24 square inches of interior venting?

 

 

 

Edited July 3 by SeaDawg

[DunnYet]

Update - We have been in Southern Colorado for the last several days mooch docking with a cousin who has a cabin northeast of Durango. Daytime temps in the high 70's, overnights in the mid 40's. The isotherm attained the food safe range (between 33 and 40 F) the first night we were there and stayed there the whole time we were on 30-amp shore power. 

I don't want to assume design flaw (as in "Refrigerator will only keep things cold when it's cold outside.") but at first glance it appears that we were just dealing with the fact that the compressor fridge could not keep up with the high temps of Texas and New Mexico. However, possibly a combination of insulation on the back of the refrigerator compartment combined with fan forcing hot air out of the compartment may be the answer. 

The internal venting still puzzles me. Since our internal temp sensor mounted over the bathroom door shows the cabin at 91F while crossing the Texas prairie, it does not seem like forcing air from the refrigerator compartment into the cabin or forcing 91F air from the cabin into the compartment behind the fridge will make a difference. I don't see how the compressor fridge will work safely without some type of external venting.

Makes me wish I had paid more attention to intro to fluid dynamics. Would welcome any thoughts on this.

[rich.dev]

18 minutes ago, DunnYet said:

However, possibly a combination of insulation on the back of the refrigerator compartment

This is my next step, adding 3M Thinsulate insulation to the inside of the bottom outside hull behind the refrigerator as well the microwave. I have already removed the microwave but haven’t figured out yet how to remove the Isotherm refrigerator.

This is what is looks like behind the microwave and Isotherm.

[jd1923]

16 minutes ago, DunnYet said:

I don't see how the compressor fridge will work safely without some type of external venting.

or any fridge! Not to worry now until you hit sea level and warmer temps. Enjoy the High Country while you’re there and don’t go to lower elevation, until goin’ home. We were 94 in Prescott today, 115 in Phoenix!

I will link my new thread here, soon re a cooling fan for the fridge. That’s all you need, just enjoy the Rockies in the meantime. Stay High and stay cool! Yeah

[DunnYet]

@jd1923 the funny thing is that the only time I have to think about how Reset 2.0 works is when we are camping in it. 🙂 I end up with a running list of "mod this mod that" and "am I doing this right or just expecting something that is not the predicted result."

Our loop back to Texas gives us the more Colorado nights - then over to Kansas, Olkahoma, and back into Texas. Enjoying the solo stove nights while we can. But the end result is two more filled in spots on our US Map. 😀

 

[jd1923]

@DunnYet, great pics and glad your mind is off the fridge and back to having fun! “Back to Texas” we love Texas! Going to the Texas Rally, Inks lake in October? Would be great to meet you there! Been 6 years for us, and over 10 years since Texas was our home. Enjoy your travels!

Edited July 7 by jd1923

[Mike and Jill]

@DunnYet We also have the isotherm fridge in our 2023 LE 2, and have had problems with interior temps running warmer than we like for food safety (upper 40s). What I found out is that we have to defrost our fridge every week to two week. After defrosting our temps will even out within the fridge compartment , Then as it starts to build frost on the freezer coil our temps will remain cooler on the upper shelf (38) and but start to rise to almost 10 degrees warmer in the food tray at the bottom (45-47). This is with the thermostat set on 4 to 5, the plastic tray below the freezer removed,  and we do not currently have an interior fan within the fridge. So, hopefully this help a little.

[DunnYet]

9 hours ago, jd1923 said:

Going to the Texas Rally, Inks lake in October?

Can’t wait - we are site 46. Inks Lake is one of our favorite parks. Last time we were there we discovered a great local winery nearby as well. Looking forward to meeting everyone! I hope that by then that Reset (the original LE I ) has new people to travel with and we can get them to attend as well.

[DunnYet]

1 hour ago, Mike and Jill said:

What I found out is that we have to defrost our fridge every week to two week

We did a short shakedown trip the weekend before leaving and did not do a full shutdown of the trailer, so that could definately help. Will do that when we get home to test.

Sounds very similar to our experience. Thanks for that tip!

[jd1923]

3 hours ago, DunnYet said:

Can’t wait - we are site 46. Inks Lake is one of our favorite parks...

We booked site 71, see you there! 

I started a new link on adding a cooling fan. Yours would be somewhat different, but worth doing. It would be painful to defrost often on extended trips.

 

[rich.dev]

I believe there might be a ventilation flaw  with the 2023+ Olivers with Isotherm fridge, at least mine. There is no vent at the bottom so cold air can enter at the bottom, pass behind the fridge and warm air can leave at the top. Per the installation instructions, see “ventilation” in last pic. 

I have emailed Oliver, will post the response.

Vent at top of my fridge

 

No vent at bottom of my fridge

Installation instructions

Edited July 7 by rich.dev