Dreiha Atmos 4.4 Home Install

[Ronbrink]

This long awaited swap-mod is now checked off my to-do list!  Like many, I tolerated the noisy Dometic Penguin ll long enough; so glad I was finally able to take decisive action with this install. After a couple years of mulling over the various replacement models being marketed, a unit emerged that caught my attention; the newly available Atmos 4.4 seemingly met all of my expectations. I will forego the removal of the Dometic, here is how I proceeded forward:

First and foremost, all AC and DC power sources were turned OFF! Scaffolding and equipment/supplies were then staged for Dometic ‘liftoff’ and subsequent Atmos ‘lunar landing’ (only appropriate since I live a couple miles from the NASA Mission Control Center in Houston).

Roof area in need of cleaning. Notice the raised fiberglass landing on my year model and that the former condensate drain tube was simply disconnected rather than cutoff. 

Roof area throughly cleaned and prepped. I decided to adhere the square self-adhesive foam roof seal directly onto the fiberglass and then apply non-leveling Dicor around the cutout perimeter to further ensure the best seal possible. In positioning the foam seal, care was taken to center it as evenly possible, thereby allowing about 1/4-3/8” of exposed fiberglass to lay a bead of the Dicor and finger smooth to finish.

Interior view of the Atmos being positioned over the roof cutout. Note the use of the mounting bolts as a guide, as recommended by SDG. Because the ‘rough cut’ edges of the layers of fiberglass (inner and outer hulls, and spacial filler) were inconsistent, I used the foam seal as a reference to accurately center and align the unit; distances measured to each respective bolt. 

 

Initially, installation instructions were followed by adhering the supplied straight piece of self-adhesive foam onto the bottom of the unit as a rear support, but it did not make contact with the roof due to relief of the aforementioned fiberglass landing. Alternatively, the foam piece was cut in half and each adhered onto the fiberglass, in like manner as the square seal, along the outer edges of said landing. This adaptation proved very effective in application and purpose, as the last of the next three pics demonstrates.

Now that the exterior unit is properly positioned and supported, it’s back inside to further installation. As a side note, I made use of a portable a/c to buffer the heat and humidity of the day! Although my son helped with the heavy lifting and positioning, I cut him loose and completed the remaining tasks solo. Before proceeding, I used foil tape to treat the end of the aforementioned condensate drain tube and secure it to the side. Next the installation of the fabric air plate duct subassembly was started (provided Dreiha Atmos 4.4 Manual details the process). Note I used foil tape on both the upper (at Atmos bottom) and lower (at mounting frame) duct plates, even though most installs viewed applied to the mounting frame plate only. Between the upper and lower duct plate installs, the ceiling assembly mounting frame was bolted in place and hand torqued using a screwdriver only (torque specified in Manual).

The AC power connection was very straightforward. The ceiling assembly’s junction box cover was removed, a strain relief fitting installed at one end (the other end had a preinstalled protector) and respective wires routed inside. I reused the Wago Lever-Nuts from the Dometic install, but first tinned the stranded wires of the Atmos lead for optimum assurance in application; electrical tape was used to further secure the Wago connectors. Ground wires were secured per the Manual.

 

 

The junction box cover was then replaced, DC thermostat wire bundle loom wrapped and tucked away for future use, and ceiling grille fastened in place.

.

I’m very pleased with this mod, quality of the Atmos and ease of installation! I should mention that SDG preinstalled a SoftStartRV. I will provide an update once the furnace wiring and thermostat mount is completed. A special shoutout to @rideadeuce for forging the way with his install of an Atmos!

Edited October 6 by Ronbrink

[jd1923]

6 hours ago, Ronbrink said:

Roof area in need of cleaning. Notice the raised fiberglass landing on my year model…

Great work Ron! You have so many great upgrades and this is one, as you know, I’ve been waiting to observe!

Got me thinking and will soon get on a ladder to see if hull 113 has that strange “landing.”

I’m going to read this again and follow your thread. Sometime late winter we will work such upgrade. Thank you my friend! 😂

 

[Ronbrink]

On 9/18/2024 at 9:17 PM, jd1923 said:

will soon get on a ladder to see if hull 113 has that strange “landing.”

I noticed in review of @rideadeuce’s install post that his 2018 OLEll, #308, with a Dometic 13,500 BTU unit did not have that feature. In his situation the straight piece of self-adhesive foam was placed onto the rear bottom of the Atmos, as I initially did, and served its’ purpose to support and level. Oliver started installing DPll 11,000 BTU units in my year model (2020), which may have prompted a change over the former 13,500 BTU unit installs. 

Edited November 11 by Ronbrink

[Ronbrink]

On 9/18/2024 at 2:14 PM, Ronbrink said:

DC thermostat wire bundle loom wrapped and tucked away for future use

Today’s project, making sense of this wiring to enable Dometic heater/wall thermostat operation. This pic was taken during the Atmos install of the stock DC wiring harness. Standby!

 

[jd1923]

3 hours ago, Ronbrink said:

Today’s project, making sense of this wiring to enable Dometic heater/wall thermostat operation.

Looking forward to understanding this. SDG recommended to replace the Dometic thermostat with a simple furnace thermostat. That's what I was told when I called SDG. 

I've been wondering why I could not just keep the Dometic thermostat where only furnace operation would be controlled, the other functions would be null, wires taped open. This assumes you control the Atmos via the Atmos remote. I have this model thermostat:

[Ronbrink]

25 minutes ago, jd1923 said:

Looking forward to understanding this. SDG recommended to replace the Dometic thermostat with a simple furnace thermostat.

This is the “simple furnace thermostat” provided by SDG. Take notice it is currently on my dining table, as I just came in the house from getting the Dometic heater functioning. That should tell you something! Details of what I was able to make do forthcoming.

[Ronbrink]

On 10/3/2024 at 11:37 AM, jd1923 said:

This assumes you control the Atmos via the Atmos remote. I have this model thermostat

Since you mentioned the Atmos remote, I received the replacement GREE model from Amazon this morning; primarily because it has a backlight, which the stock remote lacks. Based on the product description I was unsure if it would work with the Atmos, being ‘This is NOT a universal air conditioner remote control’ and there was no compatible match. Free Returns, right? Well, I’m happy to report is does work, at least good enough for now; it came with no instructions so I need to further assess its full functionality. Better yet, it fits in the stock wall mount! BTW, I have the same Dometic thermostat.

Edited November 11 by Ronbrink

[Ronbrink]

On 10/3/2024 at 12:05 PM, Ronbrink said:

Details of what I was able to make do forthcoming.

As previously indicated, my Dometic furnace is ‘good to go’!  I will preface the following by saying this task was not as difficult as first perceived, perhaps because my DPll 11,0000 BTU unit wiring setup was unique. When installing the Atmos I did not take time to mess with the furnace wiring and thermostat dilemmas, one hurdle at a time. Having watched several install videos on SOBs and closely followed @rideadeuce’s experience with SDG, I remained uncertain regarding the furnace apparatus; wiring configurations varied and In all instances the existing thermostat was abandoned. While dismantling the DPll I found all AC/DC  wiring involved a plug&play box, specifically a control box as part of a Dometic single zone kit to include a thermostat and wiring harness, as well (PNs: control box 3313191.000, thermostat 3316410.700). I didn’t think much of it at the time, since the Atmos junction box was all needed to connect AC power. However, in the days following the install my thoughts focused on the furnace and then it occurred to me that maybe the control box could be retained, making use of the existing DC harness and stock thermostat. First some afterthought matters to address:

When installing the Atmos A/C wiring I did not utilize the inherent strain reliefs within the junction box, so it was opened, wires further secured, done. I decided to better seal the fiberglass edges of the ceiling cutout to inhibit potential unwarranted air draw (from within/between hull walls) given the higher operational CFM of this unit. In particular where the wires entered, a piece of closed cell foam was cut to size and shoved into the opening followed by an application of foil tape around said cut edges, to the extent possible, done. Onward!

 

Here is how I proceeded forward:

The ceiling grille was removed, mounting frame plate bolts loosened to free the loom wrapped DC wire bundle tucked away at initial install and ensure clearance of the control box within the void of perceived securement, DC wiring harness connected to the control box and all staged for an operational test of the furnace/thermostat. With AC/DC powers restored, I was pleased to find the Dometic thermostat operational, but had to chase an E5 code on the display. Although specific to the a/c, the freeze sensor wire needed to be plugged into the control box to clear the code. In order to test the furnace the Atmos was first used to drop the interior temp to 73.8° with the thermostat ‘FURNACE’ set to 77°.  Voila!

 

Following a second successful test of the furnace, the mounting point of the control box was cleared of an adhesive stock piece of foam and box prepared for installation. A self-adhesive strip of Velcro was applied to the leading edge of the box and subsequently affixed into position. The foam piece was then positioned against the box and pressed in place to help stabilize it. Next, corresponding wires were connected in respective ports, wire loom secured with tie wraps and tucked away, mounting frame plate bolts retightened, cover grille reattached and decorative screw covers placed for a final install, YAHOO!

 

 

Edited October 5 by Ronbrink

[jd1923]

35 minutes ago, Ronbrink said:

While dismantling the DPll I found all AC/DC wiring involved a plug&play box, specifically a control box as part of a Dometic single zone kit to include a thermostat and wiring harness, as well (PNs: control box 3313191.000, thermostat 3316410.700). I didn’t think much of it at the time, since the Atmos junction box was all needed to connect AC power. 

Excellent work Ron! You know I had asked, "why couldn't the Dometic thermostat be kept as-is for furnace mode only?"

Perhaps it's safe to say in future installations, the installer should remove the AC wiring from the control box but keep all DC wiring as-is (including the freeze sensor wire). Mount the Dometic control box within the Atmos cover as you have demonstrated, and the furnace mode will work with the OEM installed Dometic thermostat.

With your pioneering efforts, I and others will be able to work this as part of the initial installation. 😂

[jd1923]

On 9/18/2024 at 12:14 PM, Ronbrink said:

I’m very pleased with this mod, quality of the Atmos and ease of installation! I should mention that SDG preinstalled a SoftStartRV.

Any chance you have a picture of the SoftStartRV installed? I have one installed in our Dometic P2 and would reuse it if possible, given it's in working condition.

Another question: why is soft start necessary for this more efficient A/C? I understand you have a 2KW Xantrex. Would it be necessary with the 3KVA Victron MP2?

[Ronbrink]

25 minutes ago, jd1923 said:

Any chance you have a picture of the SoftStartRV installed?

Search this:

[mountainoliver]

Ronbrink, do you have a little bit better view of the overall area/location/description of where the old Dometic control box is placed in the new ac unit? The close ups are great but I’m not understanding the location. Also, does your factory installed thermostat have individual wires or like mine, does it use a telephone type wire? Thanks 

[Ronbrink]

5 hours ago, mountainoliver said:

Ronbrink, do you have a little bit better view of the overall area/location/description of where the old Dometic control box is placed in the new ac unit? The close ups are great but I’m not understanding the location. Also, does your factory installed thermostat have individual wires or like mine, does it use a telephone type wire? Thanks 

You’ll have to stretch your imagination a bit, hopefully you can visualize in your mind’s eye the approximate location. The control box occurs in the void between the bottom of the roof unit and the top of the new mounting frame plate, that space being the depth of the cutout measured from roof surface to ceiling surface. In the first pic (Dometic) the box would occur in the vicinity of the white label seen over the drain line. The second pic (Atmos) is a bottom view of the mounting frame plate with the box being situated on its’ topside, nestled up against the duct, a couple inches from the top right mounting bolt and faced outward along the downward angled edge of said plate. Looking closely at the third pic you can see the threaded bolt to the left and duct plate immediately right of the control box. The forth pic shows the three wire thermostat cable. The last pic may be of interest, wiring diagrams for the control box and thermostat. Hope this helps.

Edited October 6 by Ronbrink

[mountainoliver]

So, for clarity, your thermostat wiring is a three wire cable not a telephone type cable with a telephone type plug on each end.

Edited October 6 by mountainoliver
Clarification

[Ronbrink]

25 minutes ago, mountainoliver said:

So, for clarity, your thermostat wiring is a four wire cable not a telephone type cable with a telephone type plug on each end.

Actually there are three wires (red, white, green) in the white sheath leading and connecting to the thermostat.

 

Edited October 6 by Ronbrink

[mountainoliver]

Okay got it! Not a telephone type wire/connectors. Mine must be the only one that was wired using telephone type wire and connectors. 

[jd1923]

15 hours ago, mountainoliver said:

Okay got it! Not a telephone type wire/connectors. Mine must be the only one that was wired using telephone type wire and connectors. 

Likely you will just leave the wiring you have at the thermostat and control box. The "telephone" connector has often been used for plug-n-play electronics, so consumers do not have to do any real wiring. It is a 4-wire connector where sometimes just 2 or 3 of the 4 available wires are used. The old "twisted pair" landline telephones only used 2 of the 4 wires (black/red and yellow/green). Four were used only when there was a second line into a home or business. I have spliced these phone cables to change the terminal on one end. If you do the wires are of such fine gauge they should be soldered.

[Ronbrink]

On 10/5/2024 at 12:16 PM, jd1923 said:

Another question: why is soft start necessary for this more efficient A/C? I understand you have a 2KW Xantrex. Would it be necessary with the 3KVA Victron MP2?

Perhaps this excerpt by a contributor to the sprinter-source.com forum will provide answer to your question:

“The need for a soft start on an RV air conditioner isn't a new problem, this is the case with all 13.5k and 15k BTU air conditioners I've encountered. RVers have always known they experience air conditioner operation problems at low voltage campgrounds, particularly in the high temperature high current demand times of summer camping. The air conditioner compressor won't compete for power, it just doesn't run. The air conditioner fan runs but the compressor won't start if the shore power voltage is to low, because it can't get enough current. Issues with air conditioner high LRAs have become more apparent with the popularity of Lithium batteries and inverters. Folks want to run their air conditioner off Lithium batteries and a 3000w inverter, but dampening the LRA is the only way to do that. The Atmos LRA is 48.5a, Dometic Penguin ll LRA is 52a, and the Truma LRA is 58a. Micro-Air was the first company to realize the RV industry needed a solution for reducing air conditioner compressor LRA, which is why they created the EasyStart. Micro-Air had this market cornered until just a couple of years ago when SoftStartRV started producing a similar type of soft start device. Both the EasyStart and SoftStartRV dampened the Dometic Penguin ll's LRA to around 24a. The lower the LRA the easier for the RV electrical system to run it (shore or generator power or Lithium battery/inverter). All us LTVers have added EasyStarts or SoftStartRVs to our Dometic Penguin lls. The Truma technicians I interviewed at the Tampa RV Super Show made it clear their air conditioner needed a soft start and the if you wanted to use Lithium batteries and a 3000w inverter. They also were very clear that a 3000w inverter was the minimum sized inverter to operate their unit. I believe the SoftStartRV is the only unit that is compact enough to fit inside the Truma Aventa. Based on my observations of the Atmos running off my Xantrex 3000w and 1 of my Lithionics 320ah Lithium battery and then 2 and 3 batteries, I suspect it doesn't really have a soft start. The Atmos brochure says it has a "Low voltage startup function." The marketing for these Gree manufactured air conditioners are quite misleading, using the words low voltage startup, soft start, and inverter compressor in vague terms. I'm installing a SoftStartRV on my Atmos tomorrow to see if it improves upon some of the concerning behaviors I've been seeing. The Truma and Atmos have the identical Rated Load Amperage (RLA) of 10.5a at 120vAC or 136.5a at 13vdc (Lithium battery voltage). The Dometic RLA was 12.9a. The RLA is considered a maximum normal steady state operating current. Air conditioners can run on lower RLAs, as low as 70% under their RLA. In my testing of the Atmos I see it is using less RLA, which is very good. The Atmos heat mode runs about 20-30a more for heat mode. The Atmos brochure says cooling current is 11a (143a at 13vdc) and heating is 10a (130a at 13vdc), but I suspect those numbers have been accidentally reversed, because heat mode definitely takes more current and runs slightly louder in decibels than the Atmos cooling mode.“

 

 

[mossemi]

22 hours ago, jd1923 said:

The old "twisted pair" landline telephones only used 2 of the 4 wires (black/red and yellow/green).

Was (black/red) tip or ring?😉

Mossey

[Ronbrink]

On 10/7/2024 at 7:20 AM, Ronbrink said:

“I suspect it doesn't really have a soft start. The Atmos brochure says it has a "Low voltage startup function." The marketing for these Gree manufactured air conditioners are quite misleading, using the words low voltage startup, soft start, and inverter compressor in vague terms.”

For those that may find this statement confusing, when SDG first introduced the Dreiha Atmos 4.4 there was some misinformation spread via a video interview with Kevin Searer, owner and exclusive distributor for these units in the U.S.; said video was taken down soon after its release as pertinent factual information was disclosed. There was no purposeful intent by Kevin to mislead, only lack in understanding product claims and marketing tactics. I also recall a YouTuber that made an apology for conveying misinformation, as well. 

On 10/7/2024 at 7:20 AM, Ronbrink said:

“The Atmos brochure says cooling current is 11a (143a at 13vdc) and heating is 10a (130a at 13vdc), but I suspect those numbers have been accidentally reversed,”

I concur, based on personal experience with the Atmos!

Edited November 4 by Ronbrink

[jd1923]

On 10/7/2024 at 5:20 AM, Ronbrink said:

The Atmos LRA is 48.5a, Dometic Penguin ll LRA is 52a, and the Truma LRA is 58a. Micro-Air was the first company to realize the RV industry needed a solution for reducing air conditioner compressor LRA, which is why they created the EasyStart. Micro-Air had this market cornered until just a couple of years ago when SoftStartRV started producing a similar type of soft start device. Both the EasyStart and SoftStartRV dampened the Dometic Penguin ll's LRA to around 24a. The lower the LRA the easier for the RV electrical system to run it (shore or generator power or Lithium battery/inverter). All us LTVers have added EasyStarts or SoftStartRVs to our Dometic Penguin lls.

Our Oliver went back to OTT for service with a prior owner (April 2018) and among other service had an EasyStart installed. I imagine, but not certain, it's still working since we can run the 13.5K BTU Dometic Penguin II by inverter, our Victron 3000VA MP2. After startup, the compressor cycles ON-OFF-ON and then stays on and blows cold. Not sure if this behavior is standard and it's always the same pattern. Is it the EasyStart that creates the initial cycling?

We will purchase an Atmos early next year and wondering, can I reuse this EasyStart on the new A/C? Is there a way to test it's functionality? Is the EasyStart product equal to the SoftStart? If it still works and is viable, I would be very happy to save $300 on a new one!

The way OTT installed this worries me a little. Why would OTT install it upside down (see picture), so that the wire harness is on top? Hoping the wire gland truly sealed the opening and the electronics stayed dry through the years. Maybe they thought the upper area near the cover would stay drier than down below.

I will be able to see internal condition when I remove it and will need to know before I order the Atmos, as SDG will install a new one with purchase. I will talk to EasyStart tech support and Kevin at SDG about this soon. I'm sure he would supply a wiring diagram for the Atmos. What do y'all think?

[Ronbrink]

@jd1923, I seem to recall from past reads some time ago that the Micro-Air EasyStart ‘Breeze’ Soft Starter was recommended for the Atmos 4.4, and that the ‘364’ model would not work. I installed the ‘364’ on the Dometic and had hopes of saving some bucks by installing it on the Atmos, but ended up having SDG install the SoftStartRV brand they use. 

[Ronbrink]

19 hours ago, jd1923 said:

Is it the EasyStart that creates the initial cycling?

Don’t get me to ly’n! This video explains the purpose on a soft start; nothing you don’t already know, but may be informative to others less astute. This is a pic of the YT to search.

[mossemi]

I have found Micro-Air support to be very helpful.

Mossey