Seeking New Air Conditioner for Hull # 145

[ScottyGS]

Hey Gang, 

It's past time to retire the Penguin AC for something quieter and more suited to our eventual upgrade to a 600ah Lithium system. 

I know we have owners with the Truma, Houghton, and dometic freshjet 3 series.   (Thanks to Roadlotus for her write up on the FJ3)

I am leaning toward the new Dometic Freshjet 4 or 5 series.   Reasons include:  A) Quieter than the penguin (what isn't)   B) would be easy to fit into the existing structure  C) Service almost anywhere D) Has iphone app control as well as the Air Distribution Box control   and E)  Should be energy efficient enough to allow a few hours operation on a 600 ah system. 

I was considering the Furrion Chillcube but the possibility of condensate overrunning the pan down the side of the trailer is a deal killer. 

Just wanted to ask what I might not be considering on the above list OR if there is an outlier that is not on my Radar. 

TIY,

Scotty

[jd1923]

10 hours ago, ScottyGS said:

I was considering the Furrion Chillcube but the possibility of condensate overrunning the pan down the side of the trailer is a deal killer. 

Scotty (or Greg), you may know I’m the only one here with the Chill Cube installed on an Oliver. So you may say I’m biased!

I just ran a test which I’ll post soon on my Chill Cube thread. Ran it for one full week on batteries, set at 80F (it’s parked at home). Daily high temps low 90s! Without A/C with the AZ sun the cabin would be high 90s or more.

Not a drop of condensate down the hull. The Chill Cube has a condensate trough that the condenser fan runs through, picking up the water like a water wheel. But can’t promise there wouldn’t be any in humid climates. There would be much less.

Ran it for 7 days using on average 96 Ah per day ONLY! We have 320W rooftop solar which adds power in addition to the 96. Your Oliver and ours are both 2016 models. Maybe you have the same solar.

Without solar say it adds to 240 Ah per 24 hours. That’s about 10A per hour average. On full blast, it pulls 60A but not for long. Our Dometic P2 took 150A minimum and would take forever to cool down.

I'm starting another test this week with set temp at 74F. 80F is a good summer storage temp and at 74F it will be very comfortable inside. I'll bet I can run it 3-4 days at 74F in 90F+ heat. I cold never imagine this when we had LA batteries and the awful Dometic.

BTW, I’m talking DC amps that can be read with Bluetooth connection to a shunt. We do everything on 900 Ah batteries, usually un-plugged (600 Ah is a good number).

I now know for a fact the Chill cube takes 30-50% of the power compared to ANY RV A/C in the market today that is not an inverter or variable speed compressor!

If there is a little drip, level front and curbside jacks up 1/2” and the excess will run down the back corner. It’s basically distilled water, so will not stain the fiberglass like rain water catching all the chems they put in our skies.

The Chill Cube will run on batteries twice as long as the Freshjet and it’s also quieter than any other model out there, no compressor bang like the Truma, Houghton, Tosot or any US market Dometic product.

And if you’re dead set on the condensate issue, the Freshjet is your only choice.

You couldn’t pay me to own anything else now that we’ve experience the Chill Cube (a non-paid advertisement)! 😎

Edited June 15 by jd1923

[Ronbrink]

11 hours ago, jd1923 said:

If there is a little drip, level front and curbside jacks up 1/2” and the excess will run down the back corner. It’s basically distilled water, so will not stain the fiberglass like rain water catching all the chems they put in our skies.

In humid climates there will be more than just a little drip, but being slightly off level as you suggest will divert any runoff to a rear corner. Even though condensate is like distilled water, be assured there will be some staining from contaminants it picks up as it leaves the condenser and drains outward. Maintaining adequate wax on the gelcoat will help reduce said staining and further cleanup of any resulting streaks. 

[Ronbrink]

17 hours ago, ScottyGS said:

I was considering the Furrion Chillcube but the possibility of condensate overrunning the pan down the side of the trailer is a deal killer. 

Having the condensate collect in pans in the DPll and drain via the inner hull tube Oliver installs is not without issue. Many have experienced, self included, condensate water dripping inside the cabin either from drain line blockage, improper leveling on setup or excessive humidity conditions. I have no regrets abandoning the tube drain with my chosen a/c replacement and no further worry of internal leakage. Just say’n!

[BigTexas]

Another Chill Cube customer here however I've not installed it yet.  I waited until the heat pump version came out to make my purchase.  I didn't see the no drain system as a problem.  I have a small window unit at my vacation home that uses the same method of throwing condensate on the condensing coil for additional evaporative cooling.  It sounds like a waterfall when it starts but has never dripped.  Now, I realize I'm making a big leap of faith the Cube will work the same but I'm not too worried if a little condensate flows off the trailer.

We're still rocking lead acid batteries and don't have an inverter.  My goal wasn't energy conservation as we're usually plugged in or occasionally on a small generator at lunch stops.  My goal was quiet and humidity control in the trailer.  My hope is when the Cube ramps down to a constant run state, it will achieve both.  Fingers crossed

[jd1923]

3 hours ago, Ronbrink said:

In humid climates there will be more than just a little drip

My friend Ron, of course you know! Our son Adam played a USTA Tennis Tournament in the very nice Houston suburb of Clear Lake 15 years ago. I remember sitting outdoors, large-brimmed hat on for the sun, I was drippin' wet just watching! 😎 The 16-year-old boys had drenched shirts before the first set was won.

Traveling the west vs. the gulf states is night and day. Wish we had a forum member in the east with a Chill Cube for comparison.

The Chill Cube condenser fan wets the condenser by design. To my knowledge, no other A/C unit has this feature (perhaps Furrion has a patent). The water-cooled condenser increases the overall cooling efficiency.

In very dry climates (the spring is our windy dry season), the little bit of condensate it pulls out of the dry air quickly returns to the air (evaporates). I have yet to see any condensate drip on our hull. When greater cooling is needed and it's humid, the fan should create a visible mist blowing from the condenser coils. More mist means less drip. But when the volume of condensate gets large it would overflow the condensate trough and run down the hull.

[ScottyGS]

I have to say ..... I think jd1923 may have converted me to the Church of the Furrion Chill Cube. 

I was very fixated on condensate running down the outside of the trailer and NOT on the amount of power needed to run the damn thing. 

I've been doing some research on power draw on this A/C vs. the dometic and other compressor types and am pretty much amazed.  All in all about half the power needed to run the Chill Cube.   And quiet.   

We are scheduled for a lithium upgrade toward the end of the year and will have the A/C replaced at the same time.   Right now... I am going with the Chill Cube. 

Thanks JD for the help on this.   Appreciate it.   

Scotty 

[jd1923]

7 hours ago, ScottyGS said:

Thanks JD for the help on this.   Appreciate it.   Scotty 

You're welcome! And you will not be sorry. If you're waiting to later in the year, we won't get real feedback from you until the following summer. Looking forward to seeing results from somebody who lives east where humidity is certainly a climate factor in A/C performance,

I've tried running a couple studies and each time I failed to capture full data every 24 hours, but I have some preliminary findings.

With highs in the low 90s for a full week, lows high 60s, I set temp on the Chill Cube at 80F (cabin temp on Ruuvi showed 79F consistently) which is a good set temp for parking the Oliver outdoors in the summer. I got good data for three 24-hr periods which averaged at 108 Ah used per 24 hours, A/C running 24x7. I know I I took snapshots every day for a week but don't get me started on iCloud because sometimes pics just disappear off my phone!

Beyond the 3 days of verified data, I know for a fact that I ran the Chill Cube for ONE (1) FULL WEEK on our 900 Ahs! After a week SOC was down to a low 18%. This translates to 105 Ah per day. Keep in mind, when low 90s outside, and if there was no A/C running, the Oliver Cabin would get up to 99F min or low 100s!

Then I tried another test, A/C set temp at 74F which is a comfortable temp for camping. I was able to run our A/C for four (4) full days, 4x 24x7, again highs low 90s. Daily Ah used was 135, 209, 270, 136. I have no idea why yhe numbers varied in this way as the weather was rather consistent. Average over 4 days is 188 Ah per day. I cannot believe how efficient this runs.

One additional factor: these numbers are net of the fact we have 320W rooftop solar which produces 10-20A per hour half the day. Next test I should account for this or just turn off the SC so everything is pulling from the 900 Ah Epoch batteries. 

Did you know the Dometic P2 once it gets past the Soft Start procedures draws 150A or higher? In this short test, the Furrion Chill Cube on average took as much power cooling for 24 hours as the Dometic P2 would use in one hour and fifteen minutes.

Scotty, I'm seeing much better savings than "about half the power!" But camping in hot humid times in the east, you should half the power, or perhaps 40%. Can't wait to see! 

I'll run a better test in a few weeks when we get daily highs in the high 90s. It just cooled off here and thankfully for the next week or two we're back to spring-like temps in the low 80s. 😎

Edited 20 hours ago by jd1923

[CRM]

16 hours ago, jd1923 said:

Did you know the Dometic P2 once it gets past the Soft Start procedures draws 150A or higher? In this short test, the Furrion Chill Cube on average took as much power cooling for 24 hours as the Dometic P2 would use in one hour and fifteen minutes.

Scotty, I'm seeing much better savings than "about half the power!" But camping in hot humid times in the east, you should half the power, or perhaps 40%. Can't wait to see! 

With my Turbro Inverter, once it reaches set temp I'm seeing between 250-600 watts during the day in 85-95 degree weather with 80+ humidity so you're probably pretty close with your numbers- and we keep the inside temps low, too... around 70-72. Haven't monitored during the night yet but obviously the watts draw will be even lower. 

Don't know why anyone who boondocks would buy anything but an inverter AC/Heat pump. 

[Galileo]

I guess not pulling the trigger on replacing the NOISY Dometic (Penguin 2?) A/C that came with our LE2 back in early 2022 has opened the field for more upgrade options? 

I’m still hoping to DIY this project - so is the latest consensus the “Chill Cube”? Is some kind of external roof support still an issue? 

NOT on lithium or solar, almost always plugged in, so AH’s are not on our criteria list. 

We like the condensate drains through the tubes between the hulls as opposed to running off the roof - but not opposed to running it through an external tube if that is an option. 

One big reason that we haven’t rushed into anything as of yet is that we -rarely- use the A/C. It’s got to get to the high 80’s before we opt to break out the earplugs, crank the TV volume to 100, and run the A/C until we get to 70-something and shut it off again. 

I guess I’ll run the original equipment until it stops working at this rate. (That, and avoid Texas in August…)

[jd1923]

10 minutes ago, Galileo said:

One big reason that we haven’t rushed into anything as of yet is that we -rarely- use the A/C.

That's what I thought. Living in Arizona we do not travel in the summer months. Then a couple experiences changed my thinking!

Over two years ago we did a SW Utah trip, from Apr 21 to May 7th. You wouldn't think it would get hot, springtime at high elevation, and most of the trip was fine. The day we left, dropping about down 3K ft to US-93 we boondocked the first night in Wikieup, AZ. It was 93F when we got there and fortunately by 9PM it was cool enough to be in the cabin again. Back then we still had lead acid and the Dometic P2 so all we had was the Maxxfan.

Our next stop was to be Valley of Fire SP, NV where we had booked a dry camping spot. Quite a fitting name, given the forecast showed 99F highs for the next 2 days of our reservation. We wasted that money, instead having to book an electric site at the north end of Lake Meade.

Plugged in to run the G-awful Dometic A/C. I had to wear noise-cancelling headphones to watch TV and to fall asleep! Thank goodness it was only 2 of 16 nights on that trip.

Last year we did a 5-week trip to Minnesota, from May 29 to July 4th. We headed out east and swung north and took a northern route back. I believe it was 12 of 36 nights where we needed A/C. I had thought being so far north we wouldn't need A/C, bad assumption. We even had to book campsites in SD and WY where we would have much preferred to boondock in the woods but were forced into a campsite to plug in.

After that trip, I vowed never to hear that awful Dometic P2 again! And also, my goal was to gear up in Inverter and Ahs and replace the A/C with a unit that would sip vs. gulp Ahs.

For you, the freight-train NOISE of the P2 should be enough of a driver. You plug in so yeah power consumption does not matter (though we run ours for lunch breaks on the road too).

36 minutes ago, Galileo said:

I’m still hoping to DIY this project - so is the latest consensus the “Chill Cube”? Is some kind of external roof support still an issue?

Easiest DIY out there given size and weight. The only A/C model I've heard of that needs a custom platform was the Truma. The Chill Cube has a 29x29" footprint, making it a full foot shorter to the rear. It's also the lightest unit out there.

Here is my DIY thread. This link will take you down page 2 to where my installation starts. I have installed 3 RV A/C models in the last 6 years, and this one by far was the easiest. You will need to add a furnace thermostat control which I also show here: