elite 1 No 110V power proves to be a wiring issue with my transfer switch

[roguebooks]

When we arrived home today from a nine week trip I plugged into my new (and operating) 30 amp receptacle and no juice whatsoever. Very strange. No tripped GFI to reset under dinette (couldn't turn on or off). The main breakers were fine but I did reset in case. 12 volt works fine but I really need my A/C (in Florida). Not sure what to check. Inverter? Or other gizmo I am not aware of? Please help. I also tried hooking up to the receptacle in front of trailer but still nothing. Not getting any 110 juice to inside of trailer at all. 

[Frank C]

Is there anything displayed on the surge protector readout in the attic cabinet?  

[roguebooks]

Frank,

I have a 2018 Legacy Elite 1 and the only thing in the rear attic above is the 12-volt fuse box with all the little fuses and some unused cords for something or other. I would think the surge protector was below the dinette but there is nothing in there that shows me any readings whatsoever. So I really don't know where it is or what it looks like, but would love to know. 

[roguebooks]

Any videos or instruction will be most appreciated. Not so hot of an electrician. Really has me stumped. Never had a problem like this one. Been working fine for four years and then bam! Three days on the road using 12 volt and then arrive home to plug into house and nada. 

[Frank C]

14 minutes ago, roguebooks said:

Frank,

I have a 2018 Legacy Elite 1 and the only thing in the rear attic above is the 12-volt fuse box with all the little fuses and some unused cords for something or other. I would think the surge protector was below the dinette but there is nothing in there that shows me any readings whatsoever. So I really don't know where it is or what it looks like, but would love to know. 

Ours is a 2019, but maybe in 2018 the EMS display was mounted somewhere else?  Maybe in one of the compartments under the bed.  According to the 2018 Elite I manual on the Oliver University, the trailer does have the Progressive EMS.  Should look something like this. 
 

[mossemi]

I am going to assume the 120 volt AC worked yesterday.  And you have tested the 30 amp circuit at you new location to verify it is operating correctly.  Have you tested the trailer end of the power cord?  Frank mentioned the surge protector remote display located in the attic, but I am not sure where the remote display would be located in a 2018 Elite.  If you know where the remote display is located, have you checked it?  It is the first smart device that would provide useful information about the 120 volt AC power coming into the trailer and it should be checked.  You could use the inverter to provide 120 volt power by inverting the 12 volt DC battery power to make a cup of coffee, but you probably would be able to run the A/C for a very short time if you have enough battery power.  I guess we have more questions than answers at this point.

Mossey

EDIT: I guess I’m a little slow with my response, please ignore any of my questions you have already addressed.

Edited August 11, 2022 by mossemi
Late reply

[mossemi]

My 2017 LE2 remote display was installed below the street side bed and it should be obvious when you see the bright red lights scrolling through various readings as Frank’s pictures show.  The surge protector will be the first black box the incoming AC power connects to.  You should be able to find a large black cable on the inside at the same point your power cable connects to on the outside.  The surge protector may have a flat grey data cable similar to the cable that connected you old home phone to the wall jack.  If you find that flat cable, you can find the remote display at the other end of it.

Mossey

[roguebooks]

6 minutes ago, mossemi said:

My 2017 LE2 remote display was installed below the street side bed and it should be obvious when you see the bright red lights scrolling through various readings as Frank’s pictures show.  The surge protector will be the first black box the incoming AC power connects to.  You should be able to find a large black cable on the inside at the same point your power cable connects to on the outside.  The surge protector may have a flat grey data cable similar to the cable that connected you old home phone to the wall jack.  If you find that flat cable, you can find the remote display at the other end of it.

Mossey

Thanks. Tomorrow morning I will begin again. I appreciate all the help from everybody so far.

[roguebooks]

I located the ems progressive surge protector. It was under the dinette seat farthest back. It was completely blank. No lights whatsoever. I read the Ollie post about it and I bet I need a new one. No power is getting to the trailer. There is power from the house, the cord is lit up blue at receptacle, and we've used this connection without fail all summer traveling. It's just now, after three days of driving and using my batteries that it has stopped working.  I don't have a way to check the female end that hooks to the trailer, but we've never had a problem until now. Plus I tried it on the front of the trailer as well with no luck.  

[Frank C]

2 minutes ago, roguebooks said:

I located the ems progressive surge protector. It was under the dinette seat farthest back. It was completely blank. No lights whatsoever. I read the Ollie post about it and I bet I need a new one. No power is getting to the trailer. There is power from the house, the cord is lit up blue at receptacle, and we've used this connection without fail all summer traveling. It's just now, after three days of driving and using my batteries that it has stopped working.  I don't have a way to check the female end that hooks to the trailer, but we've never had a problem until now. Plus I tried it on the front of the trailer as well with no luck.  

Is the switch on the EMS display in the “NORMAL USE” position?   Not the “BYPASS EMS” position.  

[roguebooks]

Yes. Normal. 

[roguebooks]

There was a ton of rain today in Atlanta area and perhaps the female end got wet? Would that cause this?

[mossemi]

It is very difficult to diagnose issues like this without asking qualifying questions, so please be patient with everyone trying to help and don’t take any of the questions personally, we are just trying to help.  As I understand the situation, you have been traveling in the trailer for the last nine weeks and you just arrived home and plugged the trailer into the same outlet you have used in the past, which leads you to believe it is a working 30 amp receptacle.  Am I correct so far?  You also stated that you have tried both the main 30 amp trailer connection as well as the front 30 amp trailer connection that Oliver sells as a generator connection.  Both of those connectors should be wired inside the trailer at a junction box or they both go to the surge protector. I do not know the answer to that question because I don’t have the generator connection.  The surge protector could be at fault or the incoming power is at fault.  Now we need to determine where the problem is and I normally troubleshoot from the beginning and verify point A is working and progress to point B, then C and so on till the fault is identified.  A new identical surge protector like you may have is $217 on Amazon and I would want to know beyond reasonable doubt that the one I have is faulty before I bought a new one.  I believe a phone call to Progressive Industries and Oliver Travel Trailer’s service department for support and troubleshooting guidance is the direction I would go.  The pictures attached may be beneficial.

Mossey

[bhncb]

There is an automatic transfer switch that selects which outside power inlet gets directed to the EMS input. It should be a black lunchbox mounted in the same general area as the EMS and power distribution panel. There will be one cable coming in it from each of the two inlets and a third connecting it to the EMS. I would suggest removing the top cover and having a look at the wiring inside. Start troubleshooting from this point before assuming the problem is with the EMS.

[roguebooks]

7 hours ago, bhncb said:

There is an automatic transfer switch that selects which outside power inlet gets directed to the EMS input. It should be a black lunchbox mounted in the same general area as the EMS and power distribution panel. There will be one cable coming in it from each of the two inlets and a third connecting it to the EMS. I would suggest removing the top cover and having a look at the wiring inside. Start troubleshooting from this point before assuming the problem is with the EMS.

I will do so. I also will clean the 30 amp cord ends in case the wet weather these past few days traveling gobbed it up. I just can't imagine there being anything wrong inside the trailer, but I'll look again today. Jason will be my next call if I can't get this figured out. I just don't want to bother him if it is something simple. 

[roguebooks]

There is power to the trailer from the 30amp RV cord (both ends) but no power IN the trailer and a dead ems. I will look for the lunchbox and remove cover and look in there next. 

[roguebooks]

I discovered the problem. The lunchbox basically blew up at one connection. Pics will show. Now what? Call Jason or Progressive?

[bhncb]

I would call Progressive Dynamics support and forward your pictures to them. They have improved the way the wires interconnect, ie from  using the terminal strip to individual Wago lever connectors. Maybe they’ll give you some satisfaction on a replacement.

Also open a service ticket with oliver service. Yours is not the first occurrence of this issue and they need to be kept aware. They may also provide guidance regarding replacement of the switch.

[roguebooks]

1 minute ago, bhncb said:

I would call Progressive Dynamics support and forward your pictures to them. They have improved the way the wires interconnect, ie from  using the terminal strip to individual Wago lever connectors. Maybe they’ll give you some satisfaction on a replacement.

Also open a service ticket with oliver service. Yours is not the first occurrence of this issue and they need to be kept aware. They may also provide guidance regarding replacement of the switch.

I filed a claim with Progressive and also Oliver. Thanks for all the help!!! Do you think a licensed electrician could install a new one for me? Or do I need to go to a RV place?

[bhncb]

This is not a difficult job especially with the newer style wire connections. Your only real issue is going to be that cable between the switch and EMS, the one with the burnt white wire. If there isn’t enough extra slack to be able to cut back the damaged wire, a new section of cable will be required. At this point, electrician level skills will be necessary.

I’d recommend an  rv service first, mobile if possible. A residential electrician can't be as  flexible when it comes to small jobs and might not be willing to tackle something out of their norm. Maybe you have a knowledgeable  RVer close by? 

[John E Davies]

I think installing WAGO connectors would be smart for everybody. Electrical fires are not good. I just added this to my off season Honey Do list. Thanks for the information. I just ordered a multi pack on Amazon, these are way cheaper in bulk, and I plan to throw away my collection of old school wire nuts.

WAGO 221 LEVER-NUTS 175pc Wire Connector Assortment Pack

Caution, don’t buy odd brands, they may not be UL approved.!
 

Good video:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=n8gLG6c-iKc

BTW it is WAGO, not Wago, just like NATO…😬

John Davies

Spokane WA

[Shawna and Scott]

Did progressive or Oliver give you a reason why this would happen. I'm a novice on things like this but if it is something that can be prevented then it may help others not have to deal with this.

[roguebooks]

47 minutes ago, Shawna and Scott said:

Did progressive or Oliver give you a reason why this would happen. I'm a novice on things like this but if it is something that can be prevented then it may help others not have to deal with this.

No they did not. And Progressive Industries just got back with me and informed me they did not make the product, Progressive Dynamics did. Now what to do?

[John E Davies]

50 minutes ago, Shawna and Scott said:

Did progressive or Oliver give you a reason why this would happen. I'm a novice on things like this but if it is something that can be prevented then it may help others not have to deal with this.

You can open the top and check all the screw connections to see if any are loose. This design is not good for an RV that bounces down the highway.. There is always the possibility that the installer did not tighten a loose one, but that would be hard to prove 

If the wires are long enough you can add nylon cable ties to reduce motion.

John Davies

Spokane WA

[bhncb]

1 hour ago, John E Davies said:

I just ordered a multi pack on Amazon

FYI There are two sizes of these connectors. The 221-41x top out at 12 gauge. You'll need the 221-61x  10 gauge for the transfer switch.