In search of a tow vehicle. . .

[Patriot]

We had a 14 Tundra Platinum and sold it and purchased an F250 CC 6.7 liter diesel with high capacity tow package, camper pkg and a bunch of other options. Our Tundra was “capable” of towing our Ollie, but the RPMs shot up on mountain passes for sure. We felt it was a bit under powered, needed a refresh due to out dated tech, lacked cargo room, and the mpg’s were not great. Reliability I will say was excellent.
We absolutely wanted more cargo room, more comfort on long trips, much higher cab, much better fuel mileage, larger fuel tank, and the diesel brake or engine brake which has worked excellent towing the Ollie. On long mountain grades the auto engine brake is a TV and Trailer brake saver in my experience. Any diesel will cost you more in maintenance.
On our last trip of 3500 miles up through the great north woods of NY, Mass, Conn, NH, VT, and MA, we throughly enjoyed the comfort, power and high cab touring view during the trip. The odo now registers 15,000 miles and we are really pleased with everything about it. It’s a large truck and we primarily use it for a TV. As previously mentioned it’s not a daily driver or commuter, we purchased knowing this. It  sure is nice on long trips for all the reasons mentioned. 
Trucks are very scarce as a few have mentioned. There is a 3-4 month wait on Super Duty Fords according to dealers in our area. We even got a call from our salesman wanting to buy our truck back for more than we paid for it. I had no interest in this offer.

Think about how you will use your new or used truck and buy what meets your needs and naturally your budget over the long haul. Many vehicles will tow an Ollie, but stopping is a very thing to consider. You don’t want the tail wagging the dog. 
 

 

 

[Keith-n-Jill]

13 hours ago, topgun2 said:

Hint - be sure to bring your camera so that you can take a photo of all the mods (you will not believe Foy & Mirna's decoration of the interior or Steve & Tali's lifted beds and switches or Mike and Krunch's Raspberry Pi

Hey, I'm bringing a camera and a measuring tape for sure!  Rasberry Pi?  I've built a few automated things with an Arduino. Now I'm intrigued. . . 

[Keith-n-Jill]

19 minutes ago, Patriot said:

You don’t want the tail wagging the dog.

Exactly.  I'm thinking that anything smaller than half-ton might be pushing the limits in terms of safety.  I'm liking the idea of having that extra towing capacity in reserve.  Better to have too much than too little. 

[Keith-n-Jill]

On 9/16/2021 at 9:14 AM, John E Davies said:

I think that waiting is best from a financial standpoint, but that is going to be really hard to deal with emotionally. . . Or buy an old beater used 3/4 ton pickup with the idea of trading or selling it when you can buy a new truck that you really want.

John:  I've had the same thought.  We are new to RVs and TVs. I figure that much of this skill set is acquired through hard learned, on-the-job training. Once we get some experience, we'll likely find the tow vehicle of our dreams. I'm thinking that we could start the learning process with a used Nissan Titan. The resale value is low when compared to a Toyota Tundra, Ford F150,etc. The tow capacity of a Titan is around 9,400 lbs and has a big V8. As a used TV, it's a lot more bang for the buck--at least 30% less than a comparable Tundra. Around $30K would get us a nice, not too old, low mileage Titan.  The Titan can be our trainer.  We keep it a year or two, wait for this crazy market to return to normal and pick our dream TV when the dealer's lots are full.

[Mike and Carol]

35 minutes ago, Keith-n-Jill said:

John:  I've had the same thought.  We are new to RVs and TVs. I figure that much of this skill set is acquired through hard learned, on-the-job training. Once we get some experience, we'll likely find the tow vehicle of our dreams. I'm thinking that we could start the learning process with a used Nissan Titan. The resale value is low when compared to a Toyota Tundra, Ford F150,etc. The tow capacity of a Titan is around 9,400 lbs and has a big V8. As a used TV, it's a lot more bang for the buck--at least 30% less than a comparable Tundra. Around $30K would get us a nice, not too old, low mileage Titan.  The Titan can be our trainer.  We keep it a year or two, wait for this crazy market to return to normal and pick our dream TV when the dealer's lots are full.

Makes sense.

[topgun2]

K-n-J

Make sure that you check the payload capacity of that Titan before you commit.

Bill

[Keith-n-Jill]

2 hours ago, topgun2 said:

K-n-J

Make sure that you check the payload capacity of that Titan before you commit.

Bill

Here is a potentially dumb question:  Lurking around this forum, I haven't found anyone towing an Ollie with a Nissan Titan. . . is there a reason?

[SeaDawg]

Nissan Titan doesn't have a huge market share, but we do have (or had) several members who tow with a Titan. You can read a number of discussions if you click on this search link. Seems proportional to Nissan's sales, or better.

https://olivertraveltrailers.com/forums/search/?q="Nissan titan"&updated_after=any&sortby=relevancy&search_and_or=or

This is from tfltruck, April of this year.

[Keith-n-Jill]

8 minutes ago, SeaDawg said:

Nissan Titan doesn't have a huge market share,

Thanks for the info. Wow, I had no idea that Titan market share was that small. Alfa Romeo sells more cars in the US than the Titan brand. I'm stunned.

[SeaDawg]

46 minutes ago, Keith-n-Jill said:

Thanks for the info. Wow, I had no idea that Titan market share was that small. Alfa Romeo sells more cars in the US than the Titan brand. I'm stunned.

Doesn't mean it's not a good truck. Toyota has a rather meager share as well, compared to the big three, but a very loyal following.

I've never driven a Nissan Titan, but one of my friends tows a Casita with their Frontier. She's very happy. I've driven many Nissan rental cars and suvs, and the seats are all great. I liked her smaller truck. 

Honestly,  it's hard to find a bad truck these days. Titan may not have all the bells and whistles, though.  and watch the payload. Many safety features are standard in newer models.

I'm sure you've seen this, but I'll add the link, anyway. https://www.caranddriver.com/nissan/titan

The Alfa Romeo comparison tickled my funny bone. My husband and I drove to Orlando to test drive their new sports car, several years ago. From the photos, and specs,  he really wanted one. When we actually folded ourselves into it, we decided it was a really, really bad idea. 

I don't think you'd have that "folding" issue with any Nissan truck. 😅😅 Every Nissan seat I've ever sat in gave me a happy drive. 

[Keith-n-Jill]

1 hour ago, SeaDawg said:

The Alfa Romeo comparison tickled my funny bone. My husband and I drove to Orlando to test drive their new sports car, several years ago. From the photos, and specs,  he really wanted one. When we actually folded ourselves into it, we decided it was a really, really bad idea. 

Years ago, I was stupid enough to own--not just one--but two Alfa Romeos.  Why two?  You need one to drive while the other is in the repair shop.
I still lust after those cars. Someone please kick me hard if I'm ever tempted to do that again.

[Mike and Carol]

9 minutes ago, Keith-n-Jill said:

Years ago, I was stupid enough to own--not just one--but two Alfa Romeos.  Why two?  You need one to drive while the other is in the repair shop.
I still lust after those cars. Someone please kick me hard if I'm ever tempted to do that again.

The first time we lived in Germany (late 70s) I bought a 1975 Alfa Romeo Alfasud ti.  It had a 5 speed and horizontally opposed 4 cylinder engine, front wheel drive, fuel injection, quite a deal back then.  European model only.  It could cruise all day at 160 km/hr (100 mph).  Oddly enough, it was very reliable.  Had to leave it there when we came back home.  Mike

[Keith-n-Jill]

13 hours ago, Mike and Carol said:

The first time we lived in Germany (late 70s) I bought a 1975 Alfa Romeo Alfasud ti.  It had a 5 speed and horizontally opposed 4 cylinder engine, front wheel drive, fuel injection, quite a deal back then.  European model only.  It could cruise all day at 160 km/hr (100 mph).  Oddly enough, it was very reliable.  Had to leave it there when we came back home.  Mike

I've always been a sucker for Italian cars.  I know of the Alfasud. The flat four with fuel injection was a big deal at that time. Now, we have a 1971 Fiat 500 in our garage. Two cylinders, 24 horsepower, 9 feet from bumper to bumper at 1,100 lbs. You can't get a WDH for one of these either.
The parts falling off of it are among the finest in Italian engineering.  Anyway, it's more reliable than any Alfa I've ever owned.

[Keith-n-Jill]

I'm now looking at the last of the 2021 Toyota Tundras. Specifically, a 4x4 Double Cab SR5 5.7L V8.  It's tricked out nicely; tow package, bed liner, etc. My bride likes the color and we've always had good luck with Toyotas.  It's scheduled to be delivered to the dealer at the end of October. The sales guy claims that he will "come off of the sticker price a bit" to have it sold before arrival. This will be among the last of the 2021's to roll off of the line.  It seems attractive,  given the short supply of trucks and crazy-stupid markups among all of the dealers.  Any thoughts?

[ChrisMI]

2 hours ago, Keith-n-Jill said:

My bride likes the color and we've always had good luck with Toyotas.

Sounds like a winner…no way I’d pay close to new prices for used stuff.  IMO buying new at or slightly below sticker is the best strategy. If you’re going to switch vehicles anytime soon the double cab will be a little harder to sell. 

[Keith-n-Jill]

18 minutes ago, ChrisMI said:

no way I’d pay close to new prices for used stuff

Yep. I'm shocked that used vehicle prices are close to new. Lately, some dealers are advertising year-end sales.  They're still marking up vehicles with a few thousand dollars then knocking off a few hundred.  I hate buying cars. . .

 

[topgun2]

From a purely financial point of view - I trust that you plan to keep this vehicle for a bunch of years or the discount the dealer is willing to give you at least approximates the depreciation that you will encounter as soon as you drive what is basically a one year old truck off the lot.

Certainly there are many other factors to consider besides the pure financial - but ....

Bill

[Keith-n-Jill]

20 hours ago, topgun2 said:

I trust that you plan to keep this vehicle for a bunch of years or the discount the dealer is willing to give you at least approximates the depreciation that you will encounter as soon as you drive what is basically a one year old truck off the lot.

I'll typically keep a vehicle for a minimum of 80K miles before buying the next new automobile. Odds are that I'll keep this one for a while or pass it to my son. Let's face it--automobiles are a losing proposition. The big question is how badly you're getting screwed by the dealer.  Due to the chip shortage, we are in a strange market. Used, three year old Tundras (out of warranty) are on the dealer lots priced about 12% below the sticker price of brand-new 2021 Tundras. New trucks are selling above sticker price with thousands added in dealer fees and useless dealer installed options.  It's the same with any other truck brand.  Ford and GM have storage lots full of 2021 trucks that were manufactured months ago waiting for chips to arrive from Taiwan. It appears that the chip shortage may last another year. Demand outstrips supply.  I don't expect prices to drop substantially in the next six months. 

[Trainman]

I'll make it simple:

Ram, 1500 with the 5.7 Hemi

Ford, with the 3.5 V6 turbo, don't get the smaller turbo, I think it's the 2.7 engine

Chevrolet, with the 5.2 V8

Toyota, Tundra, I would pass on the present model, but the new 2022 with have a V6 and the V8 is going away, worst fuel mileage of all others. 

PS, if don't want to have to use the Anderson Hitch you can go with a 3/4 ton in any of the models above and you will be fine, you may give up a little in fuel mileage and ride comfort.

I tow my 2019 Elite II with the Ram 1500 Hemi 4x4 and I don't even know it's back there most of the time, so the decisions are many and any truck 1/2 or larger will do the job just fine. I get between 12.7 and 13.2 mpg

One other thought is go with a 4x4 model, it will have a heavier rating and the truck will set taller, plus 4x4's will have better resale values and much more in demand. 

Personally the mid-size trucks you give up a lot of extra room inside and out, plus the full size truck just do everything better for about the same cost. 

trainman

[gatorewc]

I tow with a 2020 Tundra and love it.  Mine is the Crewmax 4/4.  I agree the gas mileage is less than the other trucks mentioned but the reliability I will take all day long over Dodge, Ford and Chevy.  I wish the payload was a little higher but we don't carry the kitchen sink with us.   My buddy has the Ford Eco Boost and when he pulls his 28' RV his mileage is less than mine.  I have a Lexus 570 that has basically the same V8 as the Tundra.  Lexus 570 has around 228K miles and the engine just runs runs, and runs.  I guess that is why I bought the Tundra with the V8.  It ain't fancy with bells and whistles, but it is dependable all day every day.

[Keith-n-Jill]

2 hours ago, Trainman said:

I'll make it simple:

Ram, 1500 with the 5.7 Hemi

Trainman:  I'm with you on that one. My father-in-law has the Ram 1500 Hemi and he loves it; nicest interior of any truck that I've come across. I dig the Ram and I love the Hemi. . . but my bride doesn't like the looks of the grill.  She thinks the Toyota is "cute."  If the wife ain't happy then nobody's happy. . .

[Keith-n-Jill]

34 minutes ago, gatorewc said:

Lexus 570 has around 228K miles and the engine just runs runs, and runs.  I guess that is why I bought the Tundra with the V8.  It ain't fancy with bells and whistles, but it is dependable all day every day.

We've owned Toyotas over the years and loved every one. We ran them into the ground--logging well over 100K miles--and they just keep on going. Not too fancy but we like that bullet proof reliability. If we get this Tundra then it will stay in the family.  My son is ready to take it when we're done with it.

[SeaDawg]

6 minutes ago, Keith-n-Jill said:

We ran them into the ground--logging well over 100K miles

100k is just barely broken in, imo, with a modern truck. 😃

 

[Keith-n-Jill]

You can't make this up.  The sales guy at the dealer had emailed me the sticker on a 2021 Tundra: about $49K which included the dealer prep BS fees.  I figured that if I had to pay sticker price then I would bite the bullet and buy the thing. Anyway, I get to the dealership this morning. The sales guy pulls out his paperwork. They had added a $5,000 "Dealer Markup" as a nice little line item. I reminded him what he said about "coming off of the sticker price a bit" to have it sold before arrival. He offered to throw in floor mats. I walked out. I've bought from Marietta Toyota before.  They will never get my business again.

[ChrisMI]

2 hours ago, Keith-n-Jill said:

The sales guy pulls out his paperwork. They had added a $5,000 "Dealer Markup" as a nice little line item. I reminded him what he said about "coming off of the sticker price a bit" to have it sold before arrival. He offered to throw in floor mats. I walked out. I've bought from Marietta Toyota before.  They will never get my business again.

I would’ve done the same…after having a discussion about misleading sales tactics and wasting my time with the manager.