Potential Battery Upgrade

[topgun2]

Chris - 

I'm so sorry but I don't presently have the time to study your drawings - but - the thought occurs to me that there is some truth in what jd1923 has to say about the shunt in the original Oliver setup.

As far as I can tell mine (hull #117) will capture everything EXCEPT for the loads placed through the inverter - the 4/0 positive and negative wires go directly from the batteries to the inverter and, thus, bypass the inverter.  This really is no problem for me in that I seldom use the inverter and, thus, virtually never have it on.  Could this be the source of your -2.3 amps?

Bill

[Wayfinder]

@jd1923All good questions.  First, I had to clean up the tray and paint it, so all the batteries had to be removed.  Also, I have the new converter, so I was thinking "maybe" that had something to do with it, as I'm still learning the system.  The great news is I'm learning and there's no better way to learn the system's behavior than with old gear that I cannot wait to get rid of.  LOL

I too noticed the light still on from the solar, but I just now noticed it takes a few moments to go out after killing the power. 

I've shutdown the rig for the night, all breakers open or off and no shore power. 

It's 9pm and I'm taking readings on the batteries until I go to bet in a couple hours.  I'll check to see if there is any "real" drain on the batteries in the morning.  

Heck, I even pulled the emergency break pin to ensure the drain increased by the expected -12amps, and it did.  I suspected maybe a stuck break or something. 

I'm suspecting the BlueSky is wonky at this point since taking out the batteries for a day or so. Heck, it's old and it may have lost it's marbles, I know I am. 

I'll be at the factory next week, for other extensive upgrades, maybe I can get them to upgrade the solar controller along with batteries too, but maybe not Lithium right now.  But that's a larger discussion with Jason, his team, and my wallet. 

Again, I'm winging all this right now.  Not sure which way I "need" to go at this moment in the trailer's life, or my own travel plans, Lithium or AGM.  I know all the pros and cons with the batteries, all too well.  Decissions, decissions!  $$ Cha-ching $$

I'm not sure how long it takes for the batteries to "settle down" from being on a charger since the trailer was on shore power.  I did notice, with all this heat we have in GA, that the new converter fan was running when I opened the panel box.  I don't think I ever noticed the old fan running. Maybe it was dead, but that's not -2.3 amps worth, especially when the converter breaker was off during earlier testing.

 

13.14v - 9:25pm
13.07v - 9:40pm

Thanks for all the great suggestions.  It curious to me at this point.

Chris

Edited July 1 by Wayfinder

[jd1923]

7 minutes ago, Wayfinder said:

I've shutdown the rig for the night, all breakers open or off and no shore power.  When I walked in to kill the rig, WITH shore power plugged in, I did notice the BlueSky Remote indicated a -9amp drain.  Very very odd with only the ceiling fan on low.  I know for a fact this is different behavior than normal.  Just curious mostly. 

Curious is good! I would think the fan would cause a few amps and your Blue Sky monitor showed earlier a -2.3A draw. just keep your batteries charged in the meantime.

It's great that you are visiting OTT Service, and they are and ALWAYS have been GREAT people! Have them do a full diagnostic and report and be happy to pay for their service. Love to see their report! There is nothing technical keeping you from this appointment. 

After that do NOT do any upgrades on-the-spot, but only required repairs. The Blue Sky solar charger TODAY, can be replaced with a modern Victron, for pennies on the dollar! Amazon.com: Victron Energy SmartSolar MPPT Solar Charge Controller (Bluetooth) - Charge Controllers for Solar Panels - 100V, 30 amp, 12/24-Volt : Patio, Lawn & Garden

You do NOT, how many times can I say the word NOT, NOT at all do you want AGM batteries in the day and age of 2024!!! (and do not buy 100AH BB batteries either). I upgraded the batteries my Bigfoot RV back in 2019 to AGM, since yes 5 years ago LiFePO4 were for the rich and famous (obviously that's not us). You can get one (1) 300AH Epoch battery for $1100 today, or 460AH for $1,399 (I suggest this option) and that's likely all you need.

We here, Oliver Owners, the great people of this forum can help you with this. I'm planning so many solar/inverter/battery upgrades. And I will tell you, first stay conservative, read and learn, and I or @rideadeuce or @MAX Burner (the DC-to DC expert) and SO MANY OTHERS... will having you lovin' your solar/inverter/battery system ASAP or as soon as you may prefer. I respect your thoughtful posts. God Bless and cannot wait to meet you at an Oliver event. PM me with any questions. Best wishes, JD

[Wayfinder]

@topgun2 it's not the inverter. Good thought, but like you, I really don't use it too much. It's in an off state. 

I must say, I've had a good bit of fun touching all this stuff and getting more hands-on. 

I've been wanting to find something in retirement, whatever that will look like for me, to replace my current IT job/hobby. Something where I'm moving around more yet still staying technical. Thirty years of desk work on a keyboard in data centers has taken its toll on my back and neck. My interest has been solar and batteries for a long time, but have been nervous about doing things on my own. Usually I find when I do finally accomplish a new task or learn a new skill, I find it wasn't that hard after all. I'm a big scaredy-cat. LoL 

 

Edited July 5 by Wayfinder

[topgun2]

OK - this will not explain the 2.3 - but - did you pull the fuse on the propane detector?

[Wayfinder]

23 minutes ago, topgun2 said:

OK - this will not explain the 2.3 - but - did you pull the fuse on the propane detector?

Just so I understand your question.  Do you mean the CO2 / propane detector under the dinette by the electrical panel?  If so, then yes, I pulled the fuse during one of my tests to see where the draw was coming from.  During one test ALL 12v fuses were pulled out, just to be sure. 

Good news this morning.  After putting the trailer in "dark mode" last night, (with everything off and breakers popped open) the Blue Sky seems to have "fixed itself". After verifying the batteries had stabilized down to 12.94v and were holding this morning, I powered up the solar controller and reset the rear breakers.  In short order I noticed a more "expected" behavior from the ProRemote, with only a draw of -1.1 amps, while it was rethinking it's life's decisions.  LOL

I verified all settings as Ryan from BlueSky had me set them to a few years ago (same batteries).  All was well there.

One test I did, out of curiosity, was to change, just for a few minutes, the "self discharge" setting.  Ryan, and the user manual, suggested keeping it at 10% for FLA batteries.  I put it to 0.00% to see what the ProRemote would say the draw would be.  It immediately dropped down to 0.0amps.  After re-reading the ProRemote user manual in the house, I went back out and set it back to 10% self discharge.  The ProRemote leveled out to what I would consider a more "normal" behavior for my system, with a draw of -1.1amps consistently.  

As the sun is coming up now, the system is going from float to acceptance and back again as needed.  Also, the charge level hashes (#####) appeared much, much sooner after turning the system back on, compared to yesterday or day before.  Previously they would not show up for hours, which frankly I think was a normal behavior for my system if the power was taken away from the BlueSky for a while.  

Either way, it feels like it is "happier" now.  I'll keep an eye on it throughout the day.  I'll keep only solar on it for now and keep the shore power off until I confirm it's behavior. 

Thanks again!  Great fun learning something new that does not involve a keyboard and a desk.   LOL

I still have not gotten around to checking the draw using my clamp multimeter. I will, hopefully today.  Depends how busy I get at work.

[Wayfinder]

Update: Well, I've had the system on a few days of Solar and a few days of 20A shore power.  The BlueSky and converter seem to be working totally as expected and as it was before my battery tray clean-up. 

A good long shutdown/reboot fixes almost everything.  Even us.  LOL

I'll be at the factory for the first time in a few days.  Not sure what to expect, but excited.

Edited July 5 by Wayfinder

[MAX Burner]

If you're planning to stay at "Camp Oliver" just outside the perimeter fence at the factory, site #3 is a good one if available....  Enjoy your time there - be sure to get some "swag."

Mid-MAY at the factory:

[Patriot]

@Wayfinder
If you need a place to over night while have service done, we highly recommend here - https://www.clarkthecrow.com/ 

Melissa Wickline the owner is an incredible person and host and we had an awesome stay. 🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟

Safe Travels!

 

 

Edited July 6 by Patriot

[Wayfinder]

14 hours ago, Patriot said:

@Wayfinder
If you need a place to over night while have service done, we highly recommend here - https://www.clarkthecrow.com/ 

Melissa Wickline the owner is an incredible person and host and we had an awesome stay. 🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟

Thanks David.  That's exactly where I'm staying.

 

 

 

 

[Wayfinder]

I had this video pop up on  my "suggested list".  Very informative.  I never did understand all the different sizes and names for wires.  Americans!  We're some stubborn folk, aren't we?! 

Looks like he's doing a good job with his new training series too.

 

 

Edited July 6 by Wayfinder

[Wayfinder]

Well, as I just posted in the FB group.  I can't get new axles on #110, they will not fit, but I did go ahead and get new AGMs for now!  I just do not have time this year to fiddle with Lithium experimentation myself. They are installing my Dexter EZ-Flex system, which I had not yet gotten around to installing.  A shame they spend so many man-hours trying to fit the axles onto the frame.  I'm very pleased though with everything so far.  Very impressed by the integrity of the Oliver service team.

Jason did say the Progressive Industries converter I just upgraded to, which has a Lithium switch on it, part # PD4045CSV, is not "certified" with Lithionics, but is for Battleborns. The way I use the camper now, I really have no real "need" for Lithium, although I know I will love the future upgrade.  Let's face it, guys can get each other "excited" over new shiny tech toys. I know I do.  This might be the last set of lower-end batteries.  Mine were not even able to maintain the hot water pot, which only needs 1050 watts of power.  Since the "rube" who installed the batteries at the NC dealer connected the positive inverter cable to the wrong end of the batteries bank, the batteries did not degrade evenly, or together.  So, screw it.  Out with the old.  At least Oliver will wire everything back up correctly.  They have all the pre-cut connectors I'm sure.  Jason said it takes less than an hour typically to install the batteries.  Hopefully no more surprises.  New large windows are in along with new shades.

[CRM]

6 hours ago, Wayfinder said:

Well, as I just posted in the FB group.  I can't get new axles on #110, they will not fit, but I did go ahead and get new AGMs for now!

 

What was different about the new axles that caused them not to be compatible with your Ollie?

[jd1923]

7 hours ago, Wayfinder said:

New large windows are in along with new shades.

I'm interested in the AXLES question that @CRM asked too!

Hull 113 got new window shades a couple years ago. They fit nice and do not fall off as some have mentioned. I dislike how the shades stick out so far when sleeping or leaning at the dinette. How do we know if we have "new large windows" or not? Measurements? 

[Wayfinder]

2 hours ago, CRM said:

What was different about the new axles that caused them not to be compatible with your Ollie?

I'm not entirely sure yet, but it was a measurement that was, I think Jason said, 3/16 inch off, or something like that. I'll get details when I pick it up.  Hopefully no more issues were encountered by the team.  I don't want to be... "that guy".  LOL

[jd1923]

Got to know the details on these axles fitting. Hull 110, OTT says does not fit. Mine is hull 113 so likely the same as yours. @MAX Burner is hull 226 and I believe Art had OTT install new axles before the annual rally.

[CRM]

1 hour ago, jd1923 said:

Got to know the details on these axles fitting. Hull 110, OTT says does not fit. Mine is hull 113 so likely the same as yours. @MAX Burner is hull 226 and I believe Art had OTT install new axles before the annual rally.

Yeah, I'd like to know the details too. Already have the 5200lb axles and EZ-Flex but don't want to run into any surprises down the road if I have to change the axles out for any reason.

[johnwen]

On 7/5/2024 at 6:54 PM, Patriot said:

@Wayfinder
If you need a place to over night while have service done, we highly recommend here - https://www.clarkthecrow.com/ 

Melissa Wickline the owner is an incredible person and host and we had an awesome stay. 🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟

Safe Travels!

 

 

For sure, Melissa is top notch!  We love staying with her :)

[Mike and Carol]

15 minutes ago, johnwen said:

For sure, Melissa is top notch!  We love staying with her 🙂

We did too.

[jd1923]

4 hours ago, CRM said:

Yeah, I'd like to know the details too. Already have the 5200lb axles and EZ-Flex but don't want to run into any surprises down the road if I have to change the axles out for any reason.

Did hull #45 come with 5200 LB axles, or did you upgrade? Either way it should not be an issue for you. I was thinking @Wayfinder has 3500 LB axles and wanted to upgrade but could not for some reason, TBD or not. I have the lighter axles with EZ-Flex added and want to know what the deal with upgrading is to 5200s. Good thing for now mine are in excellent condition.

OTT service by all accounts is wonderful for those who can afford the time, the travel and cost of getting there. Way too much for me on all accounts. Getting true specs and technical data from OTT is like pulling teeth. It would be great to learn something specific here.

[CRM]

4 hours ago, jd1923 said:

Did hull #45 come with 5200 LB axles, or did you upgrade? Either way it should not be an issue for you. I was thinking @Wayfinder has 3500 LB axles and wanted to upgrade but could not for some reason, TBD or not. I have the lighter axles with EZ-Flex added and want to know what the deal with upgrading is to 5200s. Good thing for now mine are in excellent condition.

 

It came from the factory with the 5200lb axles, but I'm not sure whether the EZ-Flex system did too or if it was installed afterwards. I'm assuming that I would be able to upgrade to the newer axles without issue, but I've been burned by assuming before!

[MAX Burner]

Not sure what Jason's comments meant regarding new Dexter axles not fitting on @Wayfinder's hull....???

@ScubaRx's hull #050, as well as our #226 retro-fitted the D52's w/12" drums and Alcan 5-leaf spring packs - both are config'd with the EZ-Flex system.  

We'll be interested in hearing the back story....

[Wayfinder]

22 hours ago, MAX Burner said:

Not sure what Jason's comments meant regarding new Dexter axles not fitting on @Wayfinder's hull....???

@ScubaRx

I started a separate thread just for the axles as there will be interest in that for some time to come. 

https://olivertraveltrailers.com/forums/topic/10347-new-axles-may-not-fit-all-older-sub-frames