Hull #1291 Delivery, Inspection and Warranty Service Report

[Rivernerd]

OLIVER HULL #1291 DELIVERY, INSPECTION AND WARRANTY SERVICE EXPERIENCE

This very long post details our delivery, inspection and initial warranty service experience with our new Legacy Elite II travel trailer picked up on November 10, 2022.  I begin with our overall impressions, for those who want just the “bottom line.”

OVERALL IMPRESSIONS

The Elite II is a quality trailer worth the price paid. We are glad we waited to get the Truma upgrade package including the AC, the CP Plus Varioheat wall control and the Varioheat furnace. Oliver does not lap seal all screw holes on the roof during production, but does lap seal as part of the first year’s annual maintenance. Oliver’s production staff continues to make some mistakes, but Oliver’s Service Department promptly and effectively addresses flaws for which service tickets are submitted.

If you are interested in more detail, including how our delivery process went, the specific issues with our Hull #1291, and how they were resolved, keep reading.

DELIVERY

Ryan from Service did a generally good job with the delivery process. But, he failed to provide instructions for running the AC on battery power, which is one of the reasons we bought the Lithium Pro package. We had to figure out on our own that the AC remote must first be electronically paired with the CP Plus Varioheat wall control, and that the inverter must be switched on, or the AC unit will not be recognized by the CP Plus Varioheat wall control.  Once we completed those steps, the AC worked well on inverted battery power.

Our trailer has Goodyear Wrangler Workhorse LT tires mounted on 16” wheels. I was advised by Oliver Operations Manager Rodney Lomax that the ST tires on 15” wheels will not be installed on new trailers until March, 2023.

I asked Ryan if the tires contained balance beads. He replied that after the balance bead/valve stem issue, Oliver determined to remove balance beads from all tires going forward, and leave them unbalanced. He asserted that trailer tires don’t need to be balanced. Jason Essary and Oliver Operations Manager Rodney Lomax also advised they are satisfied that trailer tires do not need balancing.

Note Added After Towing 2000+ Miles Back to Idaho:  I do not feel the need to get the trailer tires balanced.  The trailer towed smoothly.

SPECIFIC OBSERVATIONS ABOUT THE TRAILER

Hull #1291 is the third trailer delivered with the new Truma package including Aventa AC, Varioheat furnace and CP-Plus integrated thermostat/control for heat/AC/water heater. We deferred our delivery from September to November 10 so we could get the Truma package in our 2022.

#1291 is also the third trailer to get the Victron MPPT solar charge controller, which is standard with the 2023 solar package.

I mistakenly presumed that since the Victron BMV-712 Smart Battery Monitor is mounted in the same place that the Zamp monitor was that it, too, reports solar panel charging data. It does not. It reports only the battery charge status. In trailers with both the solar and lithium packages, it is one of four ways to access battery charge data: (1) by reading the Smart Battery Monitor; (2) through the Lithionics app; (3) through the Victron Connect app and (4) by pressing “Batt” on the Seelevel monitor. Those who order wet cell or AGM batteries without a solar package have one way to check battery charge level: the Seelevel monitor.

To check on solar charge data, there is only one option: you must access the Victron Connect App and click not on the Smart Battery Monitor icon, but on the Solar Charge Controller icon. You can then see real time solar charge data (if it’s night the charge data will be 0), and historical data for the past 30 days.

The Truma AC is quiet. Although it produces 62 dB on high, the low and night settings logged in at 48 dB. It is easy to carry on a normal conversation at those levels.

The Varioheat furnace includes much more substantial ducting than what I have seen in photos of Suburban furnace installs. It is not kinked or twisted, as some have reported with previous furnaces.

Hull #1291 also includes a return air vent in the bathroom, which allows cold air to be returned to the furnace through the service area in the bottom of the trailer. This results in a much better balanced forced air heat system. Previous posters with the Suburban furnace noted that the “bilge” area under the street side bed where the external faucet is located stayed about 5 degrees above the outside ambient temperature on cold nights in the teens.  We found that, with the Varioheat furnace set to heat the cabin to 70 degrees F, the “bilge” area stayed at 38 degrees F with outside temps at 11 degrees F. We did not then worry that the plumbing and tanks below the floor would freeze.

The CP Plus Varioheat thermostat requires a learning curve, as it is not yet covered by any Oliver videos. It controls the Varioheat Furnace and the Aventa AC, as well as the Aquago water heater. AC control appears as an option on shore power, but not on battery power until the inverter is turned on. We were shown how to use it on shore power during the delivery process, but we were grateful that Oliver also provides a notebook containing owners manuals for the Truma products, as we had to study the owner’s manual later to really learn how to operate it, including when testing the AC on inverted battery power.

The fit and finish inside and outside the trailer is improved over that reported by some on this forum. The interior caulking, such as in the shower, is nicely done. As an example, the plumbing vent hole in the closet is now sealed with a gasket, rather than just caulked (sometimes incompletely) as noted by earlier posts on this forum.

INSPECTION AT DAVID CROCKETT STATE PARK

From review of posts on this forum, I had compiled a long list of nearly 100 production defects noted by posters over the past several years. I spent most of the next 3 days at David Crockett State Park inspecting the trailer inside and out to determine if any of those defects were present in our trailer. None of those issues, ranging from improperly installed windows, to missing caulk around stabilizer jacks, to improper grounding of the inverter, were found in our trailer, save two: (1) there were no rubber plugs in the drum brake backing plates and (2) there was a roof leak.

We found 5 significant issues, for which we submitted service tickets:

1. A leak appeared onto the standard bed area below the Truma Aventa air conditioner. It rained in Hohenwald the night we took delivery, then we found the leak the next day when we arrived at David Crockett State Park. As we had not used the AC, we suspected something on the roof needed to be resealed to prevent rainwater from penetrating the hull when on the road.  This issue was on my list.

2. The Truma Aquago Antifreeze unit we purchased from Oliver did not yet communicate with the Truma CP Plus Varioheat wall control unit, so it could not be used.

3. The grey tank sensor gave erratic readings that did not correlate to water usage.

4. The bath fan vent and plumbing vent screws on the roof were not sealed, providing possible leak points; and

5. The one other item that was on my checklist: The drum brake backing pads do not have rubber plugs to protect the adjustment mechanism from road grit.

When dumping the black and grey tanks before heading back to Hohenwald, the grey tank cable pull handle came out in my hand, preventing me from dumping the grey tank. When speaking with Mike Sharpe from Oliver Service, I also advised him of this issue that had come up that morning.

RETURN VISIT TO HOHENWALD

We delivered Hull #1291 to Oliver Service the late morning of Monday November 14, 2022. Later that afternoon, Jason Essary advised that his techs had verified the water leak and believed its origin was around the ventilation fan. They resealed that area, but then also applied sealant to all of the exposed screws on the roof (at no additional charge), because I had expressed concern that they were potential leak points. Operations and Sales manager Rodney Lomax advised that those screws are not sealed during production, but that the Service Department applies lap seal to them if annual maintenance is scheduled. I suggested that, like the screws that secure metal roofing to sheathing, those screws should be either gasketed or otherwise sealed as part of the manufacturing process.

We were asked to leave the trailer overnight, so the sealant could cure before leak testing the next day. Because rain was forecast for that night, and because we asked to be able to sleep in the trailer, Operations Manager Rodney Lomax arranged for the trailer to be placed under a large awning/overhang at the Sales and Service facility to keep the roof dry.

We noted when we slept in the trailer that night that all of the service ticket items had already been addressed except the water leak and the plugs for the drum brake backing plate. The grey water tank sensor was now reading consistently and the CP Plus wall unit was recognizing and controlling the antifreeze kit. The grey water tank pull handle had been reattached. [My later inspection suggested that the set screw, which secures the aluminum shaft (to which the grey tank drain handle is attached) to the guillotine valve under the street side bed, had come loose.  I expect the handle with shaft simply needed to be reinserted and the set screw properly torqued.]  We were advised that the brakes come from Dexter without plugs for the access holes, and Oliver does not supply them. So, I determined to cover the access holes with Gorilla tape until I could buy plugs online at home and install them.

We yielded the trailer to the service team the next morning, expecting that after a leak test, we could be on our way home. But, we were advised a few hours later that when leak testing, it was discovered that our windows had not been installed according to a new protocol recently implemented by Oliver, so Jason had instructed his techs to pull and properly reinstall all windows, including re-caulking exterior flanges. That took the balance of the day. Jason and some of his staff stayed until after 6:00 p.m. that evening to complete the work and return the trailer to us, so we could camp another night at the Oliver campsite rather than find a motel.

The process of addressing our multiple service tickets required us to hang out in Hohenwald for another two days, and delay our plans to return to Idaho. But, we had planned extra time for this purpose knowing that such a delay was possible. In total, we spent 6 days in Tennessee receiving delivery, inspecting and testing systems, and coordinating repairs.

We appreciate Oliver lap sealing all of the screw heads and holes in the roof of our trailer, at no charge to us. We believe all Oliver trailers should have all roof screw holes lap sealed as part of the production process. Had that been done to our trailer before we took delivery, it would have saved us a day in Hohenwald.

We also appreciate the Oliver service team for promptly addressing our service tickets right after we arrived back at their facility, and, even though it took an extra day, for ensuring that the windows were properly resealed though we had noted no issues with the windows. It is a concern that Oliver’s production staff overlooked the items for which we submitted service tickets during construction, and failed to follow the new protocol for window installation when building our trailer. But, we left (two days later than we had originally hoped) with what we believe is a high quality trailer that is worth the premium we paid for it. And we left with great respect for the integrity and commitment to quality of the Oliver service and management team.

HELPFUL THINGS LEARNED FROM FORUM POSTERS

I learned many things from posters on this forum which have made using the trailer much easier and safer.

These include:

Inserting turnbuckles into the chains of the Andersen WD hitch, with the extra chain links required to fit the Elite II. This has made it easier to attach and detach the Andersen by turning the turnbuckles to create slack. It also makes it much easier to get the “whale tail” back on if it was detached at an angle—just loosen the turnbuckle on the long side even more, and the whale tail can be installed at an angle. Then, of course, tighten the turnbuckles to tension the WD hitch. I use Robogrips to complete the tightening process. This is much easier for an old guy than crawling under the trailer to loosen the nut with the Andersen provided socket.

Using a Camco water filter and a brass hose elbow when hooking up city water

Installing a dash cam

Using a PUR water filter pitcher

Installing a Tire Minder TPMS system

Using a squeegee to wipe down shower walls

Installing X-Chocks between the wheels on the two axles.

If you posted about these items, THANK YOU!

[Steve Morris]

Thank you for the wonderfully detailed delivery report, Ralph!
 

Like you, I'm surprised and a bit disappointed that the oft reported problems are still occurring. Hopefully, someone at Oliver will see your report and knock some heads on the production floor.

I've kept mental notes on things to check at our March 28 delivery, but nowhere near 100 items. Any chance that you'd share your list?

[Ollie-Haus]

Thank you @Rivernerd for the detailed delivery report. Having worked in manufacturing my whole life I understand the challenges in quality control and continuous improvement that Oliver like all companies goes through. Not to excuse issues that are obviously preventable, but it is refreshing to see the positive response and quick resolution provided by Oliver. That second part is rare in much of the RV industry today.

We're months away from delivery day of our LEII, and much homework needs to be done for us to feel ready and confident in taking delivery. These are much more complex vehicles and systems than the RVs of our past. We are pretty savvy when it comes to tech and connected systems and devices, but there's still an obvious learning curve for each new system and app. 

On that note and in an effort to not reinvent the wheel, do you have a punch list of items you would be willing to share with folks to help us be prepared for delivery day? The search function is cumbersome at best on the forum and finding all the essential items to check may result in key items missed otherwise. Regardless I'm going to be digging deep in the weeks ahead but anything you have would be greatly appreciated. 

Chris

[dewdev]

Rivernerd:

Cograd on your new Ollie.

Could you summarize the location of the hot air vents and the location of any return air vents in your new trailer.

I would like to know that to consider making improvement in air flow in my Ollie.

[Rivernerd]

On 11/21/2022 at 6:26 AM, Rivernerd said:

I asked Ryan if the tires contained balance beads. He replied that after the balance bead/valve stem issue, Oliver determined to remove balance beads from all tires going forward, and leave them unbalanced. He asserted that trailer tires don’t need to be balanced. Jason Essary and Oliver Operations Manager Rodney Lomax also advised they are satisfied that trailer tires do not need balancing.

We arrived back home in Idaho today after driving more than 2000 miles through 8 states after leaving Hohenwald.  The trailer felt, and handled, fine, even at freeway speeds up to 70 MPH.  I do not feel the need to have the trailer tires balanced.

[Rivernerd]

On 11/21/2022 at 8:06 AM, Steve and Deb said:

Like you, I'm surprised and a bit disappointed that the oft reported problems are still occurring. Hopefully, someone at Oliver will see your report and knock some heads on the production floor.

I am sorry my report left you with that impression.  I should have written it more clearly.

To my recollection, none of the issues we found had been reported before except the roof leak and the absence of rubber plugs in the disk brake backing plates.  As I noted, Dexter does not supply the rubber plugs, and I believe Oliver had not thought to supply them.  So, the only previously reported issue that Oliver could (and should) have done better was the roof leak.

The impressive point for me was that of nearly 100 previously-reported issues detailed in my list, I found only those two, and only one was a production oversight.  So my "takeaway" was that Oliver has successfully addressed almost all of the "oft-reported" past problems. 

Please accept my apologies for any confusion.

[Mighty Mo]

Thanks for the detailed inspection report. We picked ours up on September 8th, hull#1240. I didn't know about the plugs for the brake adjustment holes not being installed and will order some. The windows not being installed correctly really concerns me. How might one visually inspect the windows to see if they are installed correctly? From what you wrote above, Jason noticed it but then he has an eye for such things. I'm going to also check the screw holes on top and seal them as you suggest.  On our trailer, the external Zamp solar plug did not have the ground connected but the wire was run and was in the black corrugated tubing so I just terminated it and all is well. Also, last week our RVLock failed and I just received the replacement battery board today. There have been several failures in recently delivered Olivers and it looks to be water getting into the mechanism and causing a short. When I take mine apart, I plan to look for water damage. There is no visible damage on the exterior. Someone mentioned they put a bead of caulk around it to help keep water out.  I have been checking my lug nuts with my torque wrench set to 120ft*lbs and have found some have loosened a bit between trips. Ours has been rained on quite a bit but so far I haven't noticed any leaks but I'm certainly going to keep inspecting for leaks just in case. 

Regards, 

Martin 

[Rivernerd]

2 minutes ago, Mighty Mo said:

Also, last week our RVLock failed and I just received the replacement battery board today. There have been several failures in recently delivered Olivers and it looks to be water getting into the mechanism and causing a short.

The reports on this forum of failure issues with the RV Lock keypads are the reason we ordered the standard handle that opens with ordinary keys.  We keep the keys in our tow vehicle.  During our 2000+mile trip back home, locking and unlocking the trailer did not seem to be an issue.

[Rivernerd]

7 minutes ago, Mighty Mo said:

The windows not being installed correctly really concerns me. How might one visually inspect the windows to see if they are installed correctly?

I don't know.  I inspected the windows after delivery, and found no issues.  They all appeared flush to the outer shell, and properly caulked. 

What Jason reported to us after we took the trailer back is that when leak testing, he noted that a "new" protocol for window installation had not been followed.  I don't know what that "new" protocol entails, or whether it would have been in effect in September.

In your shoes, I would shower the trailer with a garden hose, then check for window leaks.  If you find none, I would resort to the old maxim:  "If it ain't broke, don't fix it."

[Mighty Mo]

Yes, thanks for the advice. I've washed it a few times, hosing down the whole trailer with a power washer. Next time I'll really hit the windows and see if they leak. As you mention above, if they don't leak then don't fix them. Also, I just read another post stating that 120ft*lbs of torque is to high for the lugs on the Oliver and should be around 100ft*lbs. So the the next time I torque them I'll bring them down to 100ft*lbs. I know when I first checked them they were right at 120ft*lbs from the factory. Lessons learned on the RVLock, it came with the electronics package and I'm okay with it for the most part. It can be manually locked if needed. If it continues to be a problem, then I'll change it out with something else.  

[Mike and Carol]

9 hours ago, Rivernerd said:

The reports on this forum of failure issues with the RV Lock keypads are the reason we ordered the standard handle that opens with ordinary keys.  We keep the keys in our tow vehicle.  During our 2000+mile trip back home, locking and unlocking the trailer did not seem to be an issue.

We’ve used a key for years and it’s not really a big deal.  Sometimes simplicity is good, especially in something that goes bouncing down the highway.  Sometimes I marvel at all the new technology in newer Olivers, but then I also appreciate the simplicity of our older trailer.  Mike

[Katjo]

What a fantastic detailed delivery report! Congrats on getting your Ollie. It sounds like Oliver took good care of you and addressed issues promptly. You certainly did your homework prior to delivery, planning the extra time during and after pickup was very smart.  

I wish you many wonderful memory making  journeys ahead in your beautiful new Ollie. 

[Steph and Dud B]

10 hours ago, Mighty Mo said:

Someone mentioned they put a bead of caulk around it to help keep water out. 

We haven't had any issues with our replacement RV Lock after applying sealant to cover the gap between the top of the lock body and the door.

10 hours ago, Rivernerd said:

We keep the keys in our tow vehicle. 

We do this, even with the RV Lock, just in case it fails.

[Steph and Dud B]

9 hours ago, Mighty Mo said:

120ft*lbs of torque is to high for the lugs on the Oliver and should be around 100ft*lbs.

My tire shop, who I trust, was very leery about torquing the nuts to 120, even after I showed them the Oliver spec. 120 is right at the top end of the range for those lugs and torque wrenches do have some deviation.

[Steve Morris]

12 hours ago, Rivernerd said:

I am sorry my report left you with that impression.  I should have written it more clearly.

No, what you wrote was very clear. My disappointment is that they'd identified a problem installing windows, implemented a new protocol on how to install the windows, and yet the windows in your trailer were not installed per those new protocols. Management and QC can solve any problem, but that doesn't always help if the guy putting the parts together doesn't follow explicit instructions.

[rich.dev]

On 11/21/2022 at 8:26 AM, Rivernerd said:

Our trailer has Goodyear Wrangler LT tires mounted on 16” wheels. I was advised by Oliver Operations Manager Rodney Lomax that the ST tires on 15” wheels will not be installed on new trailers until March, 2023.

Ralph, thank you for the wonderfully detailed delivery/inspection report. Just curious why they want to switch to 15" wheels, I prefer the 16s for more clearance?

On 11/21/2022 at 8:26 AM, Rivernerd said:

From review of posts on this forum, I had compiled a long list of nearly 100 production defects noted by posters over the past several years.

Ralph, would you mind sharing your checklist with us please? 
Thanks,
Rich

[BBL]

On 11/21/2022 at 9:06 AM, Steve and Deb said:

I've kept mental notes on things to check at our March 28 delivery, but nowhere near 100 items. Any chance that you'd share your list?

Yes please!  I would also like to review your list for our 3/8/23 pick up.

Great review of your experience, thank you.

Brian

[Rivernerd]

 

On 11/21/2022 at 2:41 PM, dewdev said:

Could you summarize the location of the hot air vents and the location of any return air vents in your new trailer.

I would like to know that to consider making improvement in air flow in my Ollie.

Now that we are safely home, I have had time to take some photos.  See attached.

The first photo shows the supply air vent in the bathroom.

The second photo shows the rear supply air vent and the return air grill in the main cabin.

The third photo shows the return air vent in the bath, beside the toilet.

The fourth photo shows the return air vent in the bathroom from inside the front dinette seat.  This allows return air flow into the air space underneath the trailer.

The fifth photo shows the two supply vents in the main cabin.

 

 

 

 

[Rivernerd]

I received a request for pictures of the Truma Varioheat installation and ductwork.  Now that we are safely home in Idaho, I have had time to take photos. They are attached.

[Rivernerd]

23 hours ago, Rich.Dev said:

Ralph, thank you for the wonderfully detailed delivery/inspection report. Just curious why they want to switch to 15" wheels, I prefer the 16s for more clearance?

As reported in an earlier thread, Goodyear's acquisition of Cooper Tires forced Oliver to substitute Goodyear tires going forward.  Although Oliver obviously can get Goodyear Wrangler LT 16" tires now, (that is what is installed on our Elite II delivered November 10), Oliver has decided to go with Goodyear ST tires on 15" wheels starting in March, 2023.  They did not offer a reason.

For what it's worth, we would have preferred the 15" wheels with ST tires.  ST ("Special Trailer") tires are designed for trailer use, and have thicker, stronger sidewalls than LT tires, which are designed for "Light Truck" use.  And, with 15" wheels, you have more rubber and less metal, which provides a softer ride.

Edited November 24, 2022 by Rivernerd
New content

[dewdev]

Rivernerd:

Thanks for the pictures of the heat and supply vents. It looks like there are two supply vents and one large return air vent are similar to what is on my 2018 Elite II in the main cabin on the kitchen side of the trailer. Any other vents in the main cabin? Not sure if any of the pictures are in the bathroom. What was done in the bathroom for supply and return vents?

[topgun2]

29 minutes ago, dewdev said:

Any other vents in the main cabin? Not sure if any are the pictures are in the bathroom. What was done in the bathroom for supply and return vents?

See the 1st, 3rd and 4th pictures in Rivernerds post above for the supply vent and both the front and backside of the vent that "returns" the air into the area between the shells just aft of the black tank under the forward dinette seat.

Bill

[Rivernerd]

I have received multiple requests to post the inspection checklist I created before we took delivery on our Elite II on November 10, 2022.  I have been hesitant to post it publicly, as it was not initially created with public consumption in mind, but only for my private use.  My original version contains many personal notes that will not apply to others.

I am also concerned that the inspection checklist may create the mis-impression that Oliver makes lots of production mistakes.  Please remember that this list was compiled from hundreds of posts on this forum covering more than 5 years, and that only a few posters found multiple issues with their trailers.

But, I reflected on the fact that Oliver encourages buyers to conduct careful inspections after delivery, and to bring their trailers back to the Sales and Service Center before leaving Tennessee (like we did) so any issues can be addressed.  In the spirit of that commendable policy, I have created an updated and edited version of the document which does not include personal notes, but does include some additional comments in bold font based on what I learned during the delivery process.

Thus, a Word version of my edited inspection checklist appears below.  It now has fewer items, as I found during our delivery process that some were not relevant to the trailers being manufactured now.

Please remember that my thorough inspection after delivery revealed only one production error, of the nearly 100 defects on my original list, in our trailer (a roof leak).  It is my impression that Oliver is now paying much better attention to detail than at some times in the past, and that my fears that arose from compiling that long list of defects were mostly unfounded.

Please keep in mind that the Oliver team, including Operations Manager Rodney Lomax and Service Manager Jason Essary, did an outstanding job of promptly and effectively responding to the issues we raised when we took delivery.  They are great people with outstanding business integrity.  It would hurt me deeply if my list were used to cause them grief, after they went the “extra mile” to take such good care of us.  SO, PLEASE USE IT RESPECTFULLY AND WISELY.

 

Ralph Pond a/k/a Rivernerd

1010819054_THINGSTOCHECKONOLIVERELITEIIONINITIALINSPECTION.docx

[Jeffemac]

Thank you for your efforts and words of caution and use Rivernerd.This website is the best I’ve seen in its attempt to share known issues, non-issues, and resolved issues with the members. Very, very helpful for a soon-to-be owner!

Regards,

Jeff

[Bob n Frankie]

I want to thank Rivernerd for the great content and information that he has provided.  I am a noobie at RV’g and this will definitely make my upcoming inspection much easier to deal with.  So thank you for putting this out there for all of us.