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Well, I had a feeling this was coming... I hope it backfires on them in the worst possible way. Will Prowse Sued by Dragonfly Energy Over Alleged False and Misleading Claims About Battle Born Batteries

If Geoff ever sells their Oliver, the buyer will have to be another EE! 😎

Wow, well thought out and excellent quality work, too!

Awesome, now 37 pages in a dead heat with “Where’s Ollie!” 🤣

Not, something miscommunicated! Your D52 axles are labeled 3500 only due to the OEM installation of 1750 LB springs. They are the same D52 axles. With an Alcan upgrade you’ll have a 10K LB suspension, but 3500 axle labels and 7,000 GVWR legally per the DOT sticker on the body.

I have D52s rated 3500, the guy at Alcan claimed these were somewhat different than D52s rated 5200 - the brakes when I questioned him. Not sure I believe it.

You have all provided a lot of very interesting information. To be clear, some of it may be a bit beyond me. So a couple of info points. We have a 1 burner induction stove. It does have a separate breaker. When trying to turn the stove on, there is not any response. Possibly not wired through inverter. I have been working with a great OTT customer support person who has engaged the tech dept. Because were are in the middle of travels with the Oliver and are mostly boondocking, the customer support person is working on his end and we will reconnect when we return to home base. Staying in contact when WiFi and cell coverage is very spotty, makes it difficult to work on this issue. I’m also confident OTT will come through based on support so far and all of your responses. I’m not going to touch rewiring anything because 1) I’m limited to basic wiring 2) this unit came off the line in March (3 months ago) and is under warranty. Learning a lot. We really love this camper and what it brings to the table. But, we have to figure this out. For now, generator if we want to cook inside. Set up gas grill for outside (I don’t like to do this while we are in bear country). Eat out (had amazing Mexican meal in Cortez, CO yesterday). Eat out of the fridge (which works amazingly well). Coffee on the little propane burner. All doable. I’ll let you know when we get this resolved. Lamar

There are many great postings for installing a main battery switch. Folks like them for safety reasons, to kill parasite loads during storage, or for when working on the system. But I’m not a big fan because the safety benefits are more mythical than real, and 96% of parasite loads can be killed by shutting off the 60 amp DC panel breaker. I just don’t like introducing unnecessary resistance in the high current battery circuit. In rare cases when the main battery circuit needs to worked on, the battery can be disconnected, or the 300 amp breaker can be opened. Even with liability exposure, Oliver’s decision not to have a main battery switch was a deliberate and sound engineering choice in my opinion There may be some merit-worthy arguments for one, or perhaps a lingering perception that one is needed because it’s a requirement in the marine industry for different risks. In reality, the need to cut power in 12-volt RV systems during emergencies is rare and not normal practice. Besides, most firefighters are trained to cut battery cables before looking for a switch, or trusting it. There is no shock hazard from the battery, and breakers and fuses are more reliable protection against fire hazards, than relying on the right person being in the right place at the right time to find a switch. I've seen a number of battery switch installations that completely disconnect the battery. This can actually create more credible safety hazards than it prevents. A towed trailer with its battery switched off has no emergency breakaway brakes and no gas or CO detection, both of which should never be switched off. The solar and AC chargers are also disabled in that configuration. However, switching off parasite loads is definitely a good idea for storage, but it doesn’t require switching off the entire battery. In the example shown below, the DC panel carries 96% of the parasite load. The remaining 4% of parasitic load comes from the inverter/charger, solar charger, and LP/CO alarm which are all connected directly to the battery. I don't believe it's necessary or advisable to disconnect these circuits for normal off-season storage because those parasite loads are non-consequential. For unusually long storage periods, some additional battery maintenance would be needed regardless. The parasite load percentages below are based on precise measurements of my Oliver trailer with a 390 amp battery, your setup and amperage may vary. They include electronic standby currents from various LEDs, memories, displays, power supplies, and such. There is no singular large load, but they collectively add up: Circuit Draw DC Panel load 0.48 A 96% Inverter, Solar Charger, Gas/CO detector 0.02 A 4% Total measured from battery 0.50 A 100% DC panel breakdown: Fuse Circuit Draw 2 Various electronics 0.117 A 4 Furnace 0.012 A 5 Main lighting 0.003 A 6 Fans 0.016 A 7 Truma water heater 0.113 A 8 *Furrion Radio 0.204 A 9 USB outlets 0.007 A 10 USB outlets 0.009 A Total 0.481 A *My new IRV stereo is only 0.083 A Under ideal conditions, a 0.481-amp load from the DC panel would deplete a 390 amp-hour battery in roughly 34 days. Real-world depletion will be faster due to BMS overhead and temperature effects. The remaining 0.02-amp load from the non-DC Panel circuits would take approximately 2.2 years to deplete the battery. A lead acid battery system without inverter would have less parasite draw with the DC panel shut off. It would still last a 7 month storage season before depleting the batteries to a safe 50% discharge. I used to turn off the DC panel with its 60 amp breaker under the street-side bed. Although effective, it’s inconvenient to reach. This modification provides a more convenient way to turn it off with a latching solenoid relay controlled by a small switch. Latching means it holds position without any power draw, it only consumes current for the instant it switches, adding nothing to the parasite load. These relays are designed for exactly this purpose and are commonly used in boats and RVs. I used an Intellitech style RV latching relay rated for 100 amps. The relay mounts next to the 60-amp breaker. The existing DC panel feed wire is moved from the breaker output — to the relay output. A new #4 AWG jumper goes from the vacated breaker output — to the latching relay input. Premade made jumpers with ring terminals are readily available in 6” & 12” lengths. Note: The 60 amp breaker may also have other loads such as the electric jacks. The jacks do not have parasite loads, but turning them off is a form of anti-theft protection to prevent the trailer from being towed away with jacks deployed. If you choose to move these loads to the relay, then the ring terminals need to be enlarged from 1/4” to 5/16” stud size to fit the relay. Use a sheet metal step drill to enlarge the terminal ring lugs while holding them with pliers, otherwise a twist drill will grab and destroy it. Step drills are great for drilling chip free holes in fiberglass tool. The relay is controlled with a Double Pole Double Throw (DPDT) momentary switch with a spring return to center. This is the same type of polarity-swapping switch used for the electric jacks. The switch can be located in any accessible and convenient location. I put mine in the battery compartment and wired it with a jacketed 4-conductor 18-gauge cable. The cable fits snugly through a 5/16” hole drilled next to where the DC panel wire penetrates the battery compartment. I linked one option for a switch mounting bracket. However, I made my own 3-D printed bracket with a red label to identify it as the DC panel shutoff. The print STL file is available, or I have a few extras if anyone needs one. I mounted the switch bracket with high strength double-stick foam tape and stick-on zip-tie mounts for the wire. The DC panel can now be turned on/off with the switch, without disturbing the inverter/charger, solar charger, or safety circuits. Newer Olivers have a solar disconnect switch and it’s possible to use the latching relay to disconnect the solar too. However, there is limited space on the relay’s stud for circuits so a terminal block would be needed for that purpose. I couldn’t find decent wiring instructions for the relay, so I provided a sketch. The relay comes with two fuses, use the one connected to the V+ input to power the switch. The other fuse is for an optional switch indicator LED. The switch’s V+ wire connects directly to the fuse spade with a female spade terminal. BTW: As seen in the picture, my installation is way more congested than normal due to other modifications. I have a large piece of plywood for mounting all my gadgets, you may need to glue a small wood mounting block for the relay. Just trim the insulation and use a good construction glue or epoxy. Here are some Amazon links for parts: Latching 100 amp Relay https://a.co/d/09MjQYjx DPDT momentary return to center switch https://a.co/d/0hNXSZkO Switch bracket https://a.co/d/08qc1lvY 4-18 AWG cable https://a.co/d/05Zn0CF6 6” x #4 AWG Jumper https://a.co/d/049xhKq6 Zip tie mounts https://a.co/d/0iRWzLD2 3-piece step drill kit https://a.co/d/01TaDQmg Hope you find this useful. Cheers! Geoff

Hey, y'all. It's been a minute since I've been around here as I was working on other projects. The latest project is to finally (seriously this time!) get my '19 E2 ready for sale. Part of that is getting at least the front logo refreshed. I see that that is a common issue around here. Before I call parts, what's the latest on digital / vector graphics version of the logo, side swooshes, etc? I was just thinking to do the front logo but I have a local guy who does solid work and the price he is quoting me for just the logo I'm now considering refreshing them all. But one of his main things was to try to get him a vector graphics (ex: .svg or .ai) version to work with. From what I'm reading in this and other threads, that's probably not going to happen. But...

Wow, all day long and no replies here on our 36-page Alcan thread! 🤣 Robert, you have a newer hull, so I assume you have D52 axles. Those with D35 axles should upgrade at the same time (my build thread below). You want to install everything NEW; D52 axles, Alcan 5-pack leaf springs, a new EZ Flex kit and new shocks. I had installed new shocks the year before, so after they tested good, I reinstalled them. I wish somebody would come up with a HD replacement shock (I've looked)! The Bulldog shocks are likely better than the OEM Monroe 555001 shocks, but they are both light duty shocks designed for 1750 LB springs. I wonder if the Oliver would tow any different without these shocks, given the HD Alcan springs. I'd like new HD shocks with similar min/max length specs but heavier, larger diameter shaft, piston and casing. Do differently? I would purchase the full Dexter EZ-Flex kit with HD shackles and wet bolts. I purchased the wet bolts from Alcan and new EZ-Flex center links only. I do love Alcan Springs, but their shackles and wet bolts are not splined so do slip, so not as good as the Dexter wet-bolts that come with the EZ Flex kit. Another route would be to look at a MORryde substitute for the entire EZ Flex kit. That's all I see, more info here =>

We don’t setup a waste line at campsites. We're never in one place for more than 5 nights and I don't deal with those fancy waste ladders which I associate with Class A RVers, who stay long with full hookups! 🤣 Instead we dump on arrival (often coming from boondocking) and on departure. When dumping, you must have the Oliver up in the front AND on the curbside. I use the LevelMate at the dump station to bring the front up a good +2" over level. Some may not know, the gray tank is on the curbside, with its outlet drain facing the streetside. If your Oliver is any lower on the curbside, your gray tank can be quite full after you thought you dumped tanks! I use an 8" Anderson block to lift the curbside jack so that it is at least +1" above level. Tanks are then fully emptied. This picture was taken at a dump station in Cedar City UT. I had to back in, so there was no other approach. You can see all what I had to do to lift the front! What's not pictured is the curbside jack is also lifted. Isn't RV life wonderful?! 😎

As is the south loop of Kalaloch CG in Olympic National Park ...where some bright summer crew member sent to repaint arrows, made a mistake. People have just had to live with the result for multiple years as the same intern also changed the maps to match the mistaken arrows. (Heard all that from a Ranger.)

The best I had was a state park in Vermont. On top of being very poorly maintained the one way road was counterclockwise and the angle of the back-in spots were setup for the road to run clockwise. And, it had lots of trees to navigate as you backed in. Thanks to one of Vermont's Green Mountain Boys for an assist.

It is so nice when campgrounds are this well thought out 😉

Thanks for the great write up and details Bill. My black tank valve is in same the position yours is (now). I'll try your drill out mod and see how things improve. I'll also try to support the cable every two feet to keep the main run as straight as possible.

Excellent idea! Mossey

Clever!

For the Alcan spring Oliver group would you do anything different if you had a second chance to make this upgrade ? or would you suggest any other improvements ?

Second choice was opening the hatch under the bed and possibly raising the bed some way to make a space. I’ve got Froli installed plus the condensation mats which might be enough, if I opened a hole in them. Fortunately this works better and makes good use of the space. I rearranged everything last night and like it better than before If this didn’t work I was going with that approach Good to know thanks! Yeah I was leaning in that direction, why use city water at all when you only need to fill the tank every couple days? Good tips … OK yeah with your encouragement this is a go - it’s already basically done. I just need to brace the tanks, maybe I’ll get the Blutech mounting frames or something else. Final bit is I just need some power, right now it has a 120V adapter but it’s 12V so I’ll go that route. For the time being I’ll use a small portable power bank.

Here’s a trick to dump your tanks when the sewer hookup is uphill from your bumper. Here I used (2) 1”x2”x8 ft from an Ace Hardware store on the Keweenaw Peninsula Houghton MI Door County WI This time I picked up (2) pieces of 1/2”x10 ft EMT conduit from HD in Ellsworth ME. I like the conduit better than the 1x2 wood. The sewer hose supports slide better on the conduit and when I get home I’ll cut each conduit in half and turn a steel rod to just fit inside the conduit to make a splice for the halves. I thought I could stick the whole 10ft length into the Oliver aluminum rectangle frame rail but bolts through the rail prevent my doing this. Bill

Very clever use of basement space. Never thought of removing the panel under the nightstand to gain a few inches of height. Blutech didn't offer their low profile filter system at the time we set ours up, and most softeners small enough for the basement have limited capacity between recharges, so we installed our filter/softener system in our TV, which also has two Blutech hose reels with quick connects for intake from city water and output to the Oliver fresh tank. The reels each hold 50' of hose, so reach hasn't been a problem. Even when full hookups are available, we fill the fresh tank and rarely use the city water port. The basement door stays shut. We also have the Nature's Head, so we only deal with fresh and gray. We run out of fresh water about the same time the grey is full. The inaccuracy of the gauges isn't much of a problem since the grey can't overfill from a single fresh tank, and we haven't ever run out of fresh water before knowing it was low. Steve

My black tank dump valve was hard to close from day 1, March 14, 2018. During the Summer of 2018 I found the installation instructions for the cable and valve and realized that it was at best a marginal install. I pulled the cable out and lubed it with a dry type lubricant and straightened the kink in the very end of the cable where the factory had screwed the set screw in and barely caught the end of the cable and bent it into the hole opposite the threaded set screw hole. This caused the cable to be slightly bowed which didn’t help the situation (See A and B below) and didn’t make valve closure any better. I also noticed that the clamp on the frame above the valve was broken and didn’t properly secure the cable sheath. I could get some clamping force but not enough to suit me. Given this and the fact that the cable/sheath/clamp length and position relationship weren’t going to permit full closure of the blade (if you have worked on bicycle brakes, throttle cables, choke cables you know what I mean) I decided to modify the clamp portion of the frame above the valve. I disassembled the frame and drilled the hole where the sheath is clamped through the bottom of the frame (See C and D below). I used a drill size that would create a tight fit of the sheath in the clamp hole. I reassembled everything, pushing the sheath lower in the frame (which also allowed me to push the end of the cable down past the set screw in the plunger) and this permitted the blade to completely close. Now with the valve closing completely I wasn’t having water in the sewer hose when I went to hook it up at a campsite but it was still difficult to open and close the valve due to the routing of the cable. Winter of 2020, I finally accepted that manual operation of the dump valve wasn’t going to be as smooth as I expected it to be so I ordered (2) stainless steel knobs from McMaster Carr, drilled and tapped them to fit on the opposite end of the cables, and installed them in place of the Valterra handles that came on the trailer. This made it easier to pull and push the cables without concern about breaking the handles. I think it was Spring 2021 when I talked to the service department about my findings and what I had done and that I still wasn’t pleased with the force required to operate the valve and that I thought it was due to the cable routing. They offered to relocate the black tank dump valve and since the sheath clamp part of the frame was broken I took them up on their offer. The service department relocated my black tank dump valve as shown below. This resulted in the valve assembly being tilted about 75 degrees from the vertical to the street side and the cable was rerouted from under the dinette seats to the street side of the dinette seat. This resulted in an improvement in valve operation, not perfect, but it is an improvement. Valve location before After, showing only the 1.5 inch sink/shower drain valve New location of the valve showing also the new routing of the cable I hope that this information is helpful to those trying to improve the operation of the black tank dump valve. I also hope my high school English teachers don’t read this. They would be appalled. Bill Very early 2018 Hull 313

Proof of concept; onboard (inboard?) water conditioning and filtering. The problem has been the water softener and iron filter. So far it’s all be a modular system I move around. A pain but flexible. I gave up on putting the tanks onboard as they’re a bit too tall for any of the storage. But poking around I found that the panel under the bedside drawer is just sitting there so … Pros All contained nicely Puts weight in the back near the wheels (I’ve got plenty in front) Always set up so just takes two hookups, one from the faucet and two to the back water input. For waterpoint boondocking (e.g. national parks) I haven’t used it. Too much to futz with pulled off at some waterpoint and usually blocking the road. Since it’s permanent those hoses won’t kink, they’re a pain as they want to kink up if you use them modular Easy to access the valves for backwashing and regenerating by just taking the drawer out which is easy It just works out nicely with the lines having the right amount of coil Cons Not so great for city water. Unless I jack into the line internally I have to keep the hatch open which isn’t optimal But that’s fine, just use the tank and pump until/if I decide to make it more permanent Takes up the back storage But that’s odd storage anyhow, I finally settled on putting a folding chair and table there, plus dirty laundry shoved through the interior hatch. And now this frees up that storage elsewhere. The tanks have been knocking about, mainly in the truck. The main filter has been in the Sea Biscuit back storage, but now I can put the chairs and whatnot there And … that’s it? I’ll sit with this a few days but I think I like it and will start to make it permanent 👍

Eek! I guess i need to take my antifreeze filter along even in warm weather. I was keeping it safe at home. Thanks for the heads up.

Yes, correct.