MAX Burner

UPDATE: The 500-mile torque inspection was actually a 527-mile torque inspection at a QT in Wichita Falls. The process is now taking only a couple minutes longer than it takes to fill up our 30+gallon tank in the Tundra. Still amazed how the new U-bolts stretch - each nut took several quarter turns to reach the target torque value! We'll be check them every 1k miles for a while. Interesting Side Note: Speaking with Mike/Alcan yesterday on a particular boring stretch of HWY 287 somewhere near Electra, TX, we learned how springs are "weight rated." Evidently, there are several algorithms used by spring manufacturers that rate springs once several parameters are uploaded. Keep in mind that ll algorithms are not exactly the same - some are more accurate than others. Values for steel type, width, thickness, alignment pin size, eye-to-eye length, etc., all determine the weight rating. Alcan uses a highly rated program with a reputation in the industry as being very accurate. Turns out that virtually all RV manufacturers, industry-wide, use spring packs that either just barely meet RVIA standards or don't meet them at all (depending on the algorithm program used to rate the springs). When Alcan ran the dimensions of the Chinese-made AXLE TEK spring used on my Oliver, it was "quite a bit less than the rated 1,750# target", according to Mike. IMO, this issue goes back to DEXTER and not necessarily Oliver - because, as I understand - but could be wrong, the axle kit (including the spring packs) are supplied by DEXTER. But even if the AXLE TEK spring packs were tested to and achieved the 1,750# target at manufacturing, after some time (not necessarily road miles, but age) - those springs will flatten (all 4 of our's did) and they will not be able to meet the target rating going forward. This is due largely to the low quality metallurgy of Chinese steel. Labor costs, environmental regulations, and manufacturing standards in China are much less, if exist at all, as compared to the US steel industry. With a suspension travel of barely 2" (just measured it) before the top of the U-bolts smack into the my Oliver's aluminum frame, I want to be sure the springs are doing what they are there to do. So owners that find themselves crawling around underneath their rigs, this is another inspection point - if your suspension ever "bottomed-out" it will leave an imprint on the frame from the top of the U-bolt. That's a good indicator your spring-packs have flattened and need attention. Also IMO, the choice between Chinese-made and US-made leaf springs for travel trailers depends on the specific needs and priorities of the manufacturer or end-user, including considerations of cost, quality, and supply chain reliability. For businesses emphasizing cost control, the Chinese-made springs may be appealing, whereas for those prioritizing quality, safety, and supporting domestic industries, US-made spring packs might be the preferred option. So, mindful owners should think about: (1) having their running gear/suspension inspected, and/or (2) upgrading their suspensions if needed, or (3) never approaching their 7k# OTT max GVWR, or (4) towing slowly only on pristine roads, or (5) not worrying about it and see what happens down the road. Sorry in advance for my rant, it's just my $0.02...

@jd1923 - Great story, brother! Thanks for sharing - you made family memories in the LeSabre just like we are doing today in Casablanca. Get your hands a little greasy, finish the job, test and inspect your work, wash your hands off - then start enjoying your efforts! Right? We'll get the 500-mile inspection completed today somewhere around Denton, TX - FYI. We'll be enjoying the trip just that much more after that torque inspection... Thanks to all...

We really enjoy Catalina SP, @DaveAndBecky_NorthernMI - beautiful area!

We departed the ABQ area mid-morning and are now boon docking near Amarillo, FYI. Even saw another Oliver enroute, "Buck and Ollie"! This thread has been very informative for us regarding spring packs. Perhaps owners will become more attentive to the "dirty side" of their Olivers - as the undercarriage and specifically, the running gear, might be overlooked for some. It's definitely not as sexy as other areas of the OTT, for sure. But, it's where the rubber meets the road that concerns us. It would be good for everyone reading this thread to crawl underneath an learn what type of axles they may have. We learned that 3500# axles can be either 2-3/8" or 3" diameter at the same weight rating. Each takes a different size of U-bolt. As noted in an earlier post, each has a different torque specification as well. As responsible owners, we should know what U-bolts we're riding on and what the respective torque specs are. Here's a good one: During our spring-pack R&R, we noticed that on the last set of U-bolts, there weren't any washers! At some point in our Oliver's life, the U-bolt nuts were installed and torqued without them. You can't get an accurate torque value without washers. We never noticed this condition until just last weekend as we were finishing up. Just another thing to look for when you're crawling around under there... @Patriot's well thought out approach to have a spare spring pack/U-bolt kit on board is rock solid. Especially, considering the Dexter 5-year warranty implications. Good on you, brother. Please note: If U-bolts are replaced, either by emergency durning on the road conditions, or by modification/upgrade in controlled conditions - please mind the torque procedure. Specifically, re-torque after first 50 miles, then at 100 miles, finally at 500 miles. Check torque settings annually - easy enough to do at the same time you're servicing your EZ-Flex suspension, wheel bearings, and doing your shock absorber inspection. We completed the first 2 torque drills today while headed eastbound on I-40 towards Amarillo. New U-bolts actually stretch until finally torqued after the 500 mile check. We'll be doing the 500 mile check tomorrow. It's amazing how much additional tightening was needed to meet the torque specs on the first 2 inspections. Bottom line, loose U-bolts can cause spring failures. Very strong left to right wind conditions while towing today, the Casablanca was rock solid back there - like always. The peace of mind is well worth the effort we went through over the past several days performing this mod. Happy Campers all! Cheers...

Here's an attempt to post a smug mug link to some random pix and the GoPro vid from last Wednesday... The GoPro vid is 11 min - don't know if it will load... we'll see. I've reviewed both he pre- and post- installation vids. There is definitely more axle travel with the lighter spring packs - no surprise there. Subjectively, the "feel" under tow seems more solid. FYI: The above pic shows a couple of the original 4-packs made by "AXLE TEK"...It's interesting that these are not labeled as "DEXTER" springs packs. AXLE TEK also makes axles much like DEXTER. Somehow, we got a mixed bag - however, the 4 brake drum assemblies and spindles are DEXTER... Loading up now for the 1st leg to Dallas, enroute to the total eclipse in Purmela, TX. More later, stay safe, ALL!

Awesome report on your trip to the Great Southwest USA, @routlaw... Thanks for posting those wonderful pix!!!

FYI: We're leaving on Tuesday and plan on visiting our newly minted grandson in Dallas - then arriving mid-day Friday at BellaRose from Dallas.... Looking forward to meeting y'all!

FYI: Finished up today - tried to upload some random shots of the spring pack R&R, but the system must still be down. Anyhow, we'll service the final wheel bearing in the morning, mount the wheels and take it for a test drive with the GoPro capturing vid of the curb-side forward assy. Stay tuned...

Hey @Geronimo John; Just wrapped up installing the Alcan spring packs.... Here's some clarification for you and those interested in this mod: YES. Dexter calls these "EZ-Flex Equalizers" for double-eye leaf springs. Good Catch, John! - I will need to re-orient my wet-bolts to the 3 or 9 position - no biggie. My thought process was that the 12 position would have the least pressure from the suspension on it. They're all flowing now, but the OTT is still "up in the air", I'll get them changed out tomorrow. This is a great example of how cool these forums are for OTT owners! I got this from Dexter: "Install the plain shackle links onto the bolt ends that protrude through the springs and equalizers. Install the flanged lock nuts onto the bolts and tighten to 30-50 Ft. Lbs." The torque values for the U-bolts will be either 45 or 65 pound-feet depending on the size of your axles/U-bolts. Easy peasy! Cheers, All...

Good question, John. Due to prior commitments, the process is still underway, worked on it for a couple hours yesterday, plan to finish it up this morning. After speaking with Mike/Alcan, here's a high-level List of Instructions for the leaf spring R&R. 1. Break loose the wheel lug nuts on all wheels; 2. With the OTT connected to the the TV, raise enough that wheels are just high enough to spin and that 4 jack stands can be placed in front and to the rear of the running gear on the OTT frame; 3. Lower OTT onto the jack stands - wheels must still be able to spin; 4. Remove wheels; 5. Pick a side to start. Place a jack stand under front axle about 2 feet inboard of wheel assy. - use a floor jack under the spring plate to raise the axle just enough to adjust the jack stand under the axle, then lower the floor jack so the axle rests on the floor jack. There should be very little tension on the suspension at this point; 6. Remove the lower shock absorber nut and push the shock up and out of the mounting hole on the spring plate, use safety wire to hold lower shock outboard and away from spring plate - helps with aligning the spring plate later on; 7. Remove the 4 U-bolt nuts/washers; 8. Remove the spring plate (at this point - we wire brushed the plate, cleaned with acetone and rattle-canned it with RustOleum, set aside to dry for later); 9. Remove the forward wet bolt from the frame mount - this allows the spring pack to drop; 10. From the Dexter center shackle, remove the corresponding Dexter shackle nuts and the outboard connecting plate - the inboard connecting plate will be removed with the wet-bolts still "press fitted" into the plate. Keep as is and ChemKlean the shackle plates, wet bolts and nuts for later assembly; 11. Throw away the cheap-ass Chinese made spring pack. (OBTW: Our's weighed 10lbs even as compared to the Alcan 5-leaf spring pack of USA steel at 18lbs! We still have the fourth spring to replace today - but the three removed so far were definitely starting to flatten.) 12. Check the centering bolt head on the Alcan spring pack so it fits into the corresponding centering hole in the spring plate. We had to file the corners on a couple of the bolts to get the correct fitment. 13. Insert the "now cleaned" shackle components to the Dexter center shackle assy. Connect Alcan spring pack (this would be the rear-most spring pack bushing for the front axle), bolt on the outboard connecting plate. 14. Check the forward wet bolt after cleaning by connecting your Lock'nLube and squeezing grease through the journal (be sure to do this with all wet-bolts). Thoroughly grease the spring pack brass bushing and wet bolt. Ensure the wet bolt can fit through the brass bushing - tap in gently using a socket over the grease nipple. 15. Lift the forward end of the spring pack and place a floor jack under at mid-point (where the spring plate will be placed in a later step). Lift the Alcan spring pack up to the forward spring mount on the frame. Ensure the centering pin on top of the Alcan spring aligns with the centering hole on the axle's spring pad. 16. Insert the forward wet-bolt by raising/lowering the floor jack and tapping the center shackle fore/aft until the bushing aligns with the mounting holes. This is a step that takes some patience. We had to use an alignment bolt from the outboard side of the mount to get the wet-bolt through from the inboard side. (NOTE: The wet-bolts have splines near the head to keep them from spinning once tightened in the shackle plate - we oriented them so the grease hole on the wet-bolt faced "UP"). 17. Place your U-bolts in place over the axle (we painted ours just to keep the rust down to a minimum - plus it looks way cooler). Place the cleaned and freshly painted spring plate in place. Install new U-bolt washers and nuts - using an "X" pattern, tighten the U-bolt nuts slowly pulling the spring plate up and into position. Use a flashlight to check that the Alcan spring centering bolt is aligning with the centering hole in the spring plate. We tied the lower shock outboard and away to a wheel lug with safety wire to make this alignment easier. 18. Install lower shock to spring plate; 19. Torque all nuts to specs. 20. Move to same side rear assy. and repeat. 21. Move to opposite side and repeat front and rear like steps 1 thru 20 above. There's probably a few extra things I did (removed, inspected, and re-packed wheel bearing, for example) but these are the key steps. Very satisfying procedure. It's worth the peace of mind knowing your running gear is in order! More to report later after complete and test driven. Cheers!

...somewhere in the neighborhood of 135 NP stickers. Probably enough to cover both sides of the main hatch, closet door, and head door! 😜

I understand that OTT uses Lippert doors and hinges. Here's one on Amazon to give an price point reference: https://www.amazon.com/Lippert-Components-Right-Screen-Radius/dp/B00S2ID4H8/ref=asc_df_B00S2ID4H8/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=485521586392&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=4574139842054065784&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9030428&hvtargid=pla-949288852508&mcid=67aafcf731843af38f9f55e2c814e88f&gclid=Cj0KCQjwzZmwBhD8ARIsAH4v1gXbBPIsLzMY-EEUdIMooWn_KGCnwFiQaKFBKVe7RHlSVs6YFIB6Hl8aAjACEALw_wcB&th=1 The Lippert door from Amazon is $675.99... FYI

@Geronimo John - John: here's the link to the item in question, FYI: https://www.hitchrider.com/nowobble.htm Don't think there's enough room in the housing of the vice to enlarge the bolts... Don't have it physically in front of me ATM.

So there's two tightening bolts on either lower side of the mounting assy (the arrow's pointing to the STBD side bolt). The bolts are "double nutted" (w/washer and lock-washer) to the assy. which keeps it tight on the shank. The "looseness" we experience is the hitch shank/receiver connection when not towing. Once there's tongue weight on the system everything is "ROCK" (pun intended) solid - provided those 2 tightening bolts are torqued down. We've got a "Hitch Vice" in the shop with bent bolts from the AS days - once I get my hands on it, I'll take @topgun2's advice and fix it with a couple grade 8's...

Same here, interior and exterior motion sensing video/audio - although in a low-density living area, we've got real good/"appropriately trained" neighbors...

Hey, John: Not sure yet - Casablanca is still off the ground. Took today off to give my low back a break! Should know by tomorrow afternoon...

Congrats, @Steph and Dud B!!! Our first grandchild, a boy, arrived last DEC - total game changer for us! Can't wait to take him out for his first camping trip...

Yeah, same here. Apparently Dexter manufactured 3,500lb axles with 2-3/8" diameter tubes (newer model) and older ones with 3" tubes. You'll need to let them know which ones you've got so they send the correct U-bolts. Mike at Alcan knows about this information and he'll be sure you're sent the right ones.

Sorry, D35s...

Just part of the "pre-departure" checklist - we always tighten the Rock Tamer bolts before departing the area... Just say'n

These Alcan's are heavy duty for sure!

Well we got off to a rather late start - forgot I had a 9am PT session for the rotator cuff repair from a few months back. Anyhow, didn't get the shop opened until 1030-ish. Thinking about JD's old-school suggestion using clay - which seems brilliant, I came up with an alternative. Short of buying an accelerometer from Amazon and obtaining objective data of the suspension system - mounting my GoPro to the undercarriage amidship seemed to be a logical path forward costing $0. We do "cheap" and "free" like champions. So, instead of having D drive around the neighborhood with me in the back playing the "rock and roll rider" - went ahead and captured GoPro video of the curb-side forward wheel assembly while trying to hit every pothole in the area. The thought process is that traveling over the same route at the same speed with the 4-pack springs first, then the 5-pack after the install might show a different deflection of the suspension.... Not 100% objective but comparative for sure. Just need to upload two comparative vids of the before and after... Started off by degreasing and painting the new (one-use) U-bolts, nuts, and washers with a healthy coat of RustOleum to keep things tidy underneath. For the most part, this is a straight forward plug-and-play R&R effort. The new springs are several pounds heavier and definitely a bit higher drop than the Chinese-made 4-packs: So, the street-side springs are successfully replaced with the new 5-packs... The curb-side springs go in tomorrow - then we'll follow-up with a short before/after GoPro ride vid. ...but now, its time for a cold one! Cheers, ALL!

Like mentioned earlier, it looks like the door could have been caught by a wind gust judging by the crack being nearer to the hinges. Short of replacing the inner skin (which is totally doable, we've done one in a previous SOB), suggest finding both ends of the crack (under the window moulding and along hinge line) and "stop drilling" a 1/8" hole there. This process will stop the crack from getting longer. Its a foam-core door, so there shouldn't be any "draft" ambient air penetrating the inside crack from outside. We've got one a couple inches under our window moulding that runs horizontally for about 10". We "stopped drilled" the crack on @ScubaRx's suggestion after he saw it in Quartzsite last JAN. Good luck, cool maintenance/repair opportunity for you, @Steve-Gwenne - let us know how it turns out! Cheers!

Been to the Silver Bean many times, got the SS coffee mug to prove it, HA! Great Joe there, for sure. This was in '18 while on our annual "Spine of the Rockies" ride going through Cortez, CO:

@ScubaRx - FYI: spent a night on Sentinel Dome back in the day after slogging up from Badger Pass on cross country skis, ah, the times of a mis-spent youth! The next morning had the most beautiful sunrise peaking over Half Dome to the east - never will forget that one... OBTW: Frankly, I'm liking your version of the tree better than AA's, anyway.