Oliver looking to partnership with RV dealerships.

[ScubaRx]

1 hour ago, Mark Patricia said:

When u have it right why change. I like the factory tour with lots of questions. Bigger doesn't mean better!!!

You sound as if you think Oliver Travel Trailers, as you know them, is going away. I don’t think anything is going to change. They are just trying to get more exposure to their products. 

[Cameron]

Given the activity on this thread, it seems that this is an issue generating big interest with Ollie owners. How could it not? We're all connected on a deep emotional level to our trailers, and by extension, the company. I understand that this development makes good business sense, and that a business has to grow or die. I'll admit that I'm often resistant to change. Many of us remember this

and this

as our first experience with OTT. Now, this is the first experience for newcomers

So, the company has already been growing and changing. The challenge for OTT is to carefully thread the needle on this development. Reputation is gained slowly and lost quickly. If a RV service center in, say Boise, can provide the same knowledgeable, quality customer care as Hohenwald, then it's a win-win. If not, the average Ollie owner may simply want to deal directly with Jason Essary and his staff, which would defeat one of the goals of this plan. I'm guessing that the sales and service people at OTT are so fantastic because it's their company. They're invested. I simply can't believe that a contracted RV sales and service center will have that level of investment. The Oliver will be just one of many RV lines they sell and service. If the company is looking for more exposure, they could push the "See and Oliver Near You" program. Existing owners are the best salespeople the company could ever find. They could also continue to take the trailers to RV shows around the country. SOB sales and service have such a bad reputation, I just don't want that to rub off on the Oliver. 

It might be interesting to consider the Airstream model. Airstream is one of the biggest competitors to the Ollie. They don't sell from the factory. They do have independently owned authorized dealers who only sell Airstreams. I'm not saying that's what I want to see, but it allows those owners to trust that when they take their trailer in for a service, the staff will know what to do. 

[HDRider]

4 hours ago, Cameron said:

It might be interesting to consider the Airstream model. Airstream is one of the biggest competitors to the Ollie. They don't sell from the factory. They do have independently owned authorized dealers who only sell Airstreams.

We gave strong consideration to AS.  It was like visiting a used car lot. 

[Wandering Sagebrush]

2 hours ago, HDRider said:

We gave strong consideration to AS.  It was like visiting a used car lot. 

One of the largest Airstream dealers in the nation appears to now be owned by Lithia Motors, one of the largest automobile dealer networks.   I don’t consider that good for the Airstream brand, and would hate to see something similar happen to Oliver.

[New2Oliver]

I can't express how disappointed I am.  I just bought an Ollie.

This is what I received via email on 8-18.  "While no definitive decisions have been made at this time, we wish to be transparent and keep you informed every step of the way."

Six days later, this was published in RVtravel.  "Oliver Travel Trailers, a family-owned company with a legacy of 18 years in manufacturing premium-quality travel trailers, announced that it will be establishing a dealer network to sell and support the Oliver product line."

Definitive decisions had indeed been made before 8-18.  It was dishonest to reach out to current owners for "feedback" when the decision had already been made.

Since the decision had already been made, current owners were not part of the process.  Which is fine.  But what I am seeing now is the polar opposite of why I bought an Ollie.  Had I known this was going to happen, I would probably not have bought one.   

I was a brand manager and director of sales and marketing of a similarly positioned product, I know how this is going to end.  It always does.  Business history is full of examples.

There will be struggles over the pricing structure.  Dealers demand margin.  Product content will be removed and the savings passed on to support dealer margins.  If a dealer needs 10%, can the price just be increased $10,000?  Of course not.  Inevitably, there will be a push to cut quality and content costs and pass that on to the dealer. 

Will Ollie finance the floorplan?  If there are 10 dealers, will there be 20 new Ollies on the lots?  If an Ollie costs $50,000 to build, will Ollie park $1 million on dealer lots every year.  A glossy sales brochure won't sell a trailer 5x the cost of the competition and dealers won't finance the floorplan.

Newly hired production managers will focus on quantity.  Quality will plunge as experienced techs building a complicated product will leave and marginally literate workers will replace them.

Social media will fill with service nightmares at new "partner" dealers and there will be stories of Ollies being returned under lemon laws.  Unethical sales practices long synonymous with RV dealerships will have be used to sell Ollies. 

The cost savings and sales increases the consultants predicted will not materialize.  Profitability will be exhausted and hedge funds with no RV experience will buy the struggling business.  Original hull prices will increase.  Post expansion hull prices will plummet.

The only question is what is the timeline of this process to play out.    

It takes decades to build a brand.  It takes one bad strategic decision to destroy it.  This is that decision.

Print this.  Put it with your build sheet.  Reference it 5 years from now.

[Gliddenwoods]

34 minutes ago, New2Oliver said:

Definitive decisions had indeed been made before 8-18.  It was dishonest to reach out to current owners for "feedback" when the decision had already been made.

I  too am disappointed that Oliver Co was not truthful ("dishonest") with the Owners. My trust in the Company has been harmed going forward. The previous Owner/Company relationship was also harmed. The Oliver Company's best sales promotion in the past has been the Owners; that has also been harmed due to this dishonest action. In many ways this is sad.

[Wandering Sagebrush]

36 minutes ago, New2Oliver said:

<snip>

It takes decades to build a brand.  It takes one bad strategic decision to destroy it.  This is that decision.

<snip>

You just articulated my fears.  I don’t know if this will be the case, but it very well may be.

[John E Davies]

1 hour ago, Gliddenwoods said:

2 hours ago, New2Oliver said:

It takes decades to build a brand.  It takes one bad strategic decision to destroy it.  This is that decision.

Print this.  Put it with your build sheet.  Reference it 5 years from now.

Humans are for the most part idiots and they will always tend to ignore the bad lessons learned in the past, in favor of decisions that yield immediate rewards… this is the reason wars happen over and over. It is illogical to expect a different outcome when you repeat an action that history has shown to have unfortunate results.

I have no desire to buy an electric car, but I am very curious to see how that works out, with car dealers refusing to inventory new units, tens of thousands of cars remaining unsold, and fears about lost revenue from the Service departments, how is this going to play out?

https://www.topspeed.com/uncomfortable-truths-about-owning-electric-car/#evs-generate-some-environmental-problems

I believe that Oliver buyers for the most part are affluent enough to not mind paying “too much” for a trailer. But if the quality, service and content plummets, that will no longer be the case. Thanks for the detailed analysis, I agree and am very saddened by this news. I truly hope it ends well for Oliver.

John Davies

Spokane WA

 

 

[johnwen]

My 2 cents..... if I were to buy a new Oliver from a dealership other than OTT, I would expect that dealership to service what they sold me.  And I would wait in line behind all the other brands they sold to get my problems fixed.  The specially trained Oliver technicians there would eventually move on and be replaced by technicians trained by who?  I've heard of quite a few problems, with OTT's current production line, putting out trailers that need fixing right away.  Problems that could have been resolved had there been better quality control in production.  If those trailers made it to a sales lot other than Oliver's and I had to experience frustrating wait lines to have something fixed that should never have left Oliver production, I think that would ruin Oliver's reputation pretty quickly.  I can only report my initial problems, toilet flange cracked, kitchen sink faucet hose wrapped around plumbing preventing it from extending more than a couple of inches, airflow around my refrigerator that allowed air into the cabin with any exterior exhausts, propane, smoke, and whatever drifted in on the wind, caulk everywhere on the roof (no leaks but lots of caulk left by a sloppy installer), a window screen that fell off the window the first time down the road because the attachment screws were stripped out and the metal clips needed spacers to extend the clips into the tracks, inside belly band (chrome strip) coming loose, 1 kitchen drawer installed incorrectly (crooked, would not lock in and needed adjustment).  And the mess with fiberglass dust and extra parts all throughout the space between the shells...sheese Louise.  These are all production problems that OTT service had to fix.  And I am so thankful to Jason and his team for taking care of me right away.  I don't think I would be so happy had I waited 6 weeks to get scheduled at another rv dealership swamped with other brand trailers.  I've heard of many other problems from other owners concerning OTT production but I only mention my own issues.  Don't get me wrong, we LOVE out trailer and are so happy to have it but my satisfaction comes from a unique trailer backed by Jason's stellar service team.  I really don't think another business would provide me with what I have in OTT's service and phone support. 

John

[Katjo]

I truly don’t think they are looking to sell at hundreds of dealers across the country. If they strategically place  a few on each coast and Midwest I think it will be quite helpful to have a trained certified Oliver tech at these locations as opposed to just in Tennessee. If they sell them through these few locations it will still be a needle in a haystack where you can purchase an Oliver. 
I have faith that Oliver will be incredibly selective and make sure their product is represented in the right hands. 
Give them a chance. 

[New2Oliver]

1 hour ago, Katjo said:

I truly don’t think they are looking to sell at hundreds of dealers across the country. If they strategically place  a few on each coast and Midwest I think it will be quite helpful to have a trained certified Oliver tech at these locations as opposed to just in Tennessee. If they sell them through these few locations it will still be a needle in a haystack where you can purchase an Oliver. 
I have faith that Oliver will be incredibly selective and make sure their product is represented in the right hands. 
Give them a chance. 

These "trained certified" techs.....on whose payroll do they appear?

[Patriot]

The end is near and…😂

[Mike and Carol]

It will be interesting to see the implementation of their plan.  For me, it’s not going to change anything.  I will continue going to my local family owned RV repair shop.  He’s been working on my trailer since early 2017 and also does several other Olivers.  A good RV repair guy can effectively work on Olivers even if they aren’t Oliver Factory Trained.  Mike

[Katjo]

32 minutes ago, New2Oliver said:

These "trained certified" techs.....on whose payroll do they appear?

Doesn’t matter. We have two excellent techs that has worked on our Oliver, one at a RV dealership and another that’s a mobile tech, neither are on Oliver’s payroll. 

[SeaDawg]

Oh, wow.

If I  were 20 years younger, I'd be applying to open a little outlet to show and sell Ollies, and hire a couple great techs to work on them, in my zone.

Many years ago, I was a service manager for a computer and business machine company.  (Eventually became vp of the same company.)

We sent our techs to training at the motherships, Atlanta and New Jersey,  anytime a new model came out. I sat on the national dealer council for one of our brands for a number of years. The brands provided training classes, and documents/manuals, and we footed the bill for transportation and hotels and meals.

This is not the end of the world, imo,  but a quite likely positive change, and a broader reach, which, I think will benefit many owners outside middle America, if Oliver can recruit the "right folks".

Big "used car" type dealerships aren't interested in a brand like Oliver. Not enough margin.  Not enough volume. But, quality folks like quality products.  I think they'll find at least a few quality, smaller outlets to keep things right. If not, back to the original model, which is not going away, according to the email.

Without any outlets or service centers in place, I personally think their announcements were frankly premature.  Oliver has always been customer-centric, and were just trying to be transparent and honest. 

Full disclosure: I'm a moderator,  and continuous owner of #12 since February,  2008. First I heard of this was Katjo's post. 

[Mcb]

2 hours ago, Mike and Carol said:

It will be interesting to see the implementation of their plan.  For me, it’s not going to change anything.  I will continue going to my local family owned RV repair shop.  He’s been working on my trailer since early 2017 and also does several other Olivers.  A good RV repair guy can effectively work on Olivers even if they aren’t Oliver Factory Trained.  Mike

 

what would an Oliver Certified Tech be certified to do that any reputable RV Repair guy can’t already do?… weld aluminum? Fiberglass work? 

I’ve never had our camper serviced by OTT, as when we’ve had issues it’s been thousands of miles away from the mothership, and I do the general maintenance myself.  My experience ( this is not a complaint ) with the service dept has been to be directed by them to contact the manufacturer of the component that’s having issues directly… whether Xantrex, LifeBlu, etc…. Which has always worked out fine.. When  issues have been beyond me, I’ve found Moble RV repair guys who are certified by Norcold, Dometic etc and are therefore connected to those companies and can deal with warranty issues etc, and know what they are doing because they do it everyday… this has worked out fine too. 

What I’ve found is that if you need an RV repair guy and you are in a campground, ask the folks that run the place for advice… ask the folks that obviously are long term campers at the place as well.. they will be quick to tell you who to have work on your camper, and who not have work on your camper..

Or at least that’s the way it’s worked for us. 

 

[johnwen]

2 hours ago, Mike and Carol said:

It will be interesting to see the implementation of their plan.  For me, it’s not going to change anything.  I will continue going to my local family owned RV repair shop.  He’s been working on my trailer since early 2017 and also does several other Olivers.  A good RV repair guy can effectively work on Olivers even if they aren’t Oliver Factory Trained.  Mike

Being on the road 11 months out of the year is a challenge for us concerning service.  If I can fix it on the road with help from a phone call to OTT or help from this forum, I fix what I can and save the big projects for OTT when we go in for our annual checkup.  I think it's worked out great so far and , yes, it would be nice to be able to stop into a place we're near to see a qualified Oliver technician.  We're out of warranty anyway but I'd much prefer a tech that has Oliver experience to do the work.

John

[Bryan in NC]

5 hours ago, Katjo said:

If they sell them through these few locations it will still be a needle in a haystack where you can purchase an Oliver. 

I will be like trying to find a Bigfoot camper 😂

[PAndrews]

Hey guys, Phil here with Oliver Travel Trailers.  It is important to understand that we as a company have not made any decisions to partner with any other entities at this time.  It is simply a consideration to offer the best service from a handful of service centers/dealers to our customers who live the farthest away from Tennessee.  We do NOT have any plans to mass produce the Oliver.  Quality will not suffer as we will still have control of manufacturing and inspecting the trailers before they roll off the line.  We haven't lied to or mislead anyone, rather, we have reached out to you, our family members and best sales force for your feedback.  Thank you for those who have responded with your concerns.  We are reading and listening to each of them and taking them seriously.  

Please let me know if you have any questions.  Have a great Labor Day weekend!

[SeaDawg]

59 minutes ago, Bryan in NC said:

I will be like trying to find a Bigfoot camper 😂

Bigfoot uses dealer outlets. 

[Steph and Dud B]

6 hours ago, Mike and Carol said:

A good RV repair guy can effectively work on Olivers even if they aren’t Oliver Factory Trained

Precisely. Therefore, there's no need for OTT to establish a dealer network to improve service. Lots of us have had warranty work done by our local shops, who were then paid by Oliver. No issue. The main reasoning for this move has to be to increase sales. However,@New2Oliver makes some solid points. We've owned 2 previous trailers from independent, non-Elkhart manufacturers that were somewhat superior in quality to the Indiana-made trailers - and slightly more expensive. Even with a better quality product, both companies went out of business. The majority of consumers couldn't appreciate the difference in quality between their trailers and the other ones sitting on the lot. But they did see the higher price. And too often chose the cheaper unit.

I'm glad our hull number is from before they start cranking out the dealer-sold units. If @New2Oliver is right, the original factory-direct units will be in demand after this transition.

[Steph and Dud B]

5 hours ago, SeaDawg said:

I think they'll find at least a few quality, smaller outlets to keep things right.

I sincerely hope so. That would be the best case scenario.

[abcsfam]

I read this as Oliver trying to reduce barriers to ownership and alleviate pain points for us existing owners.   My belief is that it will always be better to use Oliver for service and purchase but that really becomes impractical for lots of potential owners as well as existing owners.   Not all owners have a desire to be mechanics and electricians and would like to just use their trailer and leave the other stuff to someone else.   I get it and ultimately it makes sense.   Oliver seems very interested in maintaining their integrity and as long as that is the case everything else will fall in line.   

[New2Oliver]

6 hours ago, Katjo said:

Doesn’t matter. We have two excellent techs that has worked on our Oliver, one at a RV dealership and another that’s a mobile tech, neither are on Oliver’s payroll. 

This will be my last post on the subject so I don't pass on my disappointment to others with a different outlook.

It always matters how someone's incentives are aligned.  Whether it is pay, advancement, recognition, or perks, a worker's incentives must be aligned with the organization's goals.  When the worker is on someone else's org chart, then that alignment is guess work. 

Also, as an organization spreads geographically and grows, full understanding of the leader's intent or mission becomes vital.  Far flung representatives will independently make innumerable small decisions that either support, or undermine, the mission.  They will reflect, or wreck, the brand. 

In this context, it seems quite unlikely that techs and sales reps whose incentives and culture are aligned with a retail RV center will reflect the very different Ollie way of doing business.  

Culture trumps strategy.  Every time.

 

 

 

[Steph and Dud B]

Our closest non-fiberglass cousin is Airstream. They have dealers. They're more expensive than most of the competition. They seem to be doing well. How do they do it? That might be an appropriate model for OTT.

(Although I have heard some stories that Airstream quality has slipped since Thor bought them out. Can't personally say if that's true or not.)