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This is simply excellent! Don’t load that back bumper too heavily... John Davies Spokane WA

Happy Veterans Day to all the vets out there. If you are an honorably discharched veteran, starting today you can shop at AAFES (PX/BX/Exchange) online. Just go to vetverify.org for information. The background story is at: https://www.defense.gov/News/News-Releases/News-Release-View/Article/1049503/department-of-defense-extends-online-military-exchange-shopping-privileges-to-v/ We do most of our online shopping at Amazon, but do some shopping at AAFES Online. More than half the profits from PX sales go back into programs for soldiers and airmen. Mike

I can't add much, but ten years, almost 100,000 miles, including many nights without moving, because we own an awesome campsite in North Carolina where we love to spend time. That said, I understand the frustration of anyone who didn't get a proper check at the pick up (and before). You'll always get an honest picture here. Even if it's a rant snapshot. Mods don't delete honest views. Truth is, I would not look elsewhere for another trailer, even ten years later. Customer support has been excellent, even if it takes time to figure out an unusual problem. We go to the Tampa supershow every year. We could certainly afford to change if we saw something better. We have not. And, I'm sure we'd never get the same support we got from the great people at Oliver. Sherry, still roaming the continent in our 2008.

In my 2008 Ollie . . . pre super-de-duper latest technology insulation type, I added two 110 outlets between the shells and plugged in a couple of low wattage bilge heaters. When the air temp between the shells dips below 40 they come on until the intra-shell space reaches 50 degrees. Of course, this requires hookups to accomplish. We first leearned of this vulnerability when Mountainborn and Technomadia were caught in a tundra like blizzard and they both experienced problems near the outside shower area. Initally, I only had one bilge heater. But after getting stuck in a minus 6 degree wind chill for three days and having my water pump freeze (pre super-de-duper insulation) I added another heater between the shells on the curb side. Now I can tough it through the deep freeze as I plan which direction th roll outta there to a warmer place.

What he said!!! I have hull #219, the one right after John's and have not experienced anything near what him or Reed have talked about, they're trailers must have been built on a "Friday". My attempt at humor, but seriously these are well built trailers that are assembled by humans, are they " perfect", no but Oliver will definitely try to make it so!

Mark - I spent several years on the Oliver forum before we bought our 2017 Elite ll. I visited other forums (including high-end motorhome forums) and it didn’t take me long to see that Oliver issues were minor in comparison to many other brands. Yes, I read all the good & the bad, just as you are doing, There were times that I became alarmed but my goal was to hear how those issues were dealt with. From what I read & what we have experienced with our Elite ll, the Oliver team goes out of their way to address problems and make sure their customers are happy. I am a perfectionist at heart so I had to stop and think back to my husband’s past employment as a production manager in Florida. Fact is, as long as the Oliver is manufactured by humans there are going to be problems at times. Just 1 employee having a bad day (while running a machine or with a tool in hand) can mess up several trailers. Some issues may end up getting hidden during the building process & never seen by quality control. That’s most likely one of the reasons Oliver has their customers do a “shake down” stay near the factory. Now that we have our “Clever Beast” I know that we made the right choice for our needs. Would we buy one now, knowing what it is? Yes! Have we had any problems with our Elite ll? Yes, a few minor issues but they have all been dealt with quickly and we have been pleased with Oliver’s response to those problems. Would we make any order changes if we were to do it over again? Yes, we ordered a few things that we did not need but ,all in all, we are very happy. I agree with Mike’s recommendation that you contact Reed & John directly. I would also recommend taking the Oliver plant tour so you can see the manufacturing process and get any questions answered.

Mark, the two owners you mention have, at times, been very critical of their purchase causing some potential buyers to look elsewhere. You may join that group. If you’ve read through some of those threads you should have noticed a response from the Oliver company and also a number of owners that expressed satisfaction with their trailer and the company. As far as regrets, I believe the Lukens are the only owners expressing regrets on their purchase. There is also no shortage of owners who are very happy and will go on record saying so. I recommend you contact Reed and John directly to get their views. They have both been extremely helpful on this forum and also personally helpful with other owners. They will give honest views and assessments. This will probably need to be moved to a new thread so this one can stay on topic. I expect there may be a number of replies to this. Mike

That’s a great illustration of how weight distribution affects sway and why it’s important to know the weight measurements of the trailer being towed. Mike

Ann and I have been to Newfoundland and Labrador many times. Never in the Oliver but tent camping on the motorcycle. It is a wonderful place, much to see and people to meet. Hope to get back there with the Oliver for a month stay.

Brad, Thanks for posting weights. Agree, like how Oliver balanced the Ollie. Hope you don't mind me posting our rig weights, too! We will carry up to 150 additional pounds of gear in the Tundra and 20 to 30 additional pounds of gear in the Ollie when heading out on a camping trip: Here's results for our Ollie E2/Tundra rig without water in tanks and Tundra with two souls on board over 1/2 tank of fuel (38 gallon fuel tank): Steer Axle: 3340 Pounds Drive Axle: 3200 Pounds Trailer Axles: 4480 Pounds Gross Weight: 11,020 Pounds Tundra with two souls on board with 20 additional pounds of gear and 72 additional pounds of gas compared to Tundra's weight with Ollie. Tundra was about 6088 pounds when weighed with Ollie on previous day: Steer Axle: 3560 Pounds Drive Axle: 2620 Pounds Gross Weight: 6180 Pounds Ollie weight 4932 pounds Tundra weight 6088 pounds Backed into tongue weight of 452 pounds from above weights, plan to order a tongue scale next.

During our recent 3 month 10,000 mile trip to the North East, we stopped in Raphine Virginia at the Pilot Travel Store and weighted our rig. The procedure is to weight the total rig (3 zones), steer axle, drive axle, and trailer axle. Then weigh again with the rig disconnected so the trailer axle zone is the trailer disconnected and the axles and front jack are all on the 3rd zone. Then, you will have almost all the information you could ask for, including the tongue weight using a little math. FYI, my cost was $11.00 for the first weigh session, the $2.00 for the second. There was an discrepancy of 40 pounds between the two sessions, which is probably within the tolerances of the scales. Session One: Steer Axle 4,520 Drive Axle 5,180 Trailer Axles 5,880 Gross Weight 15,580 Session Two - Trailer disconnected: Steer Axle 4,800 Drive Axle 4,260 Trailer Axles 6,560 Gross Weight 15,620 So, bottom line, total trailer weight loaded is about 6,560, the tongue weight is about 680 lbs, and the axle weight is about 5,880. The easy way to calculate the tongue weight is the subtract the two different trailer axle weights. You can also examine how much weight is added to the rear tires of the tow and subtract the amount reduced on the front axle of the tow. (That calculates to 640 lbs, but remember the difference is weights due to tolerances. So a safe guess is about 660 lbs if we split the differences. This is fully loaded E2 with 4 flooded golf cart batteries, solar, extended twin beds, Honda generator in the basket, etc. Fresh water tank full, black and grey empty. So the tongue weight is about 10% of the total trailer weight. The rig tows beautifully with no sway without any equalizing or sway controls. The tow vehicle is a Dodge Ram 3500 diesel with the bed loaded. Brad - Santa Fe, NM

Mark: We are among the very happy & satisfied Oliver owners. Ours is Elite II hull #217. Was everything perfect on delivery? Mostly. Did we have a few issues once we got home? Yes. Were they all fixed? Yes, but it did require a trip back to Hohenwald. (In fairness to Oliver, they would have paid for a local repair, but I didn’t have a lot of confidence in the local RV shop.) Our learning lesson was this. The usual delivery, if it was like mine, had an explanation of how things work, and a demonstration of some. The underlying assumption was that if it was installed it would work, but that didn’t prove to be the case for the water heater on propane. My belief is that a better delivery practice would have been if I had asked the factory rep to “prove” every operating system before writing the final check. If it is supposed to make hot water on either propane or electricity, let’s see it do each one. If TV sound is supposed to come out of either the TV or the stereo speakers, let’s hear from both. Will the furnace make heat? Will the AC blow cold air, or hot if called for. Does the cell phone amplifier boost the cell signal? The WiFi booster? Can the TV really get a broadcast channel. What has to change before it can show a cable channel? It might have been tedious, but would have caught some hidden issues. The learning lesson for us was that taking delivery of an Oliver is not like taking delivery of a new car. Most of us don’t live in Tennessee, and so the dealer isn’t just down the street for warranty repair. Everything needs to be operating correctly before you hook up and drive away. The further you live from Hohenwald, the more critical a thorough delivery process becomes. Would we do it again. Absolutely. We think the Oliver Elite II is the country’s truly outstanding small travel trailer, and we couldn’t be happier with ours. John Shkor SailorsAshore

Mark - I've had zero (that I know of) stripped screws in my Oliver (hull #117). Certainly I realize that Hohenwald is a long way from Montana, but, I really do think that a visit to the factory would go a long way towards mitigating any doubts that you seem to be voicing here. Bill

Thank you All! We are at Mama Gertie's Hideaway campground in Swananoa NC. Will be returning here after a run to Hohenwald to get some work done on the flying sea turtle. Nice to know that will be able to run the onboard heater when we are not plugged in. Here is Donna and Piper having hot dogs for breakfast.

Yup, I said that and the Zamp is still overpriced garbage... But Oliver has come a long way this year in making improvements on the rest of the trailers they have been putting out. The early 2017 models and before all had the water tank issue - Now that's been fixed with the new dip tube and made even better by the factory with the addition of the bladder. The sewer compartment fix that I did and wrote about was put into the line up right after I posted it and has now been done by Oliver on every trailer since. So they are still in the learning curve, but every complete fix that one of us performs becomes standard operating procedure on newer trailers and that is a good thing. Do I still wish that I could have found a used 2016 or earlier made Elite II? Yes, basically because the 2016's and before had way better Solar, way better drawer slides, and a much better bathroom shower faucet. We have had lots of problems but they are all fixable and Oliver has sent us what we needed for repairs without question, in fact, we received another box from them this week. We have talked about the Zamp... but we have enough other issues to take care of that it's still on the list because the stripped out window latch replacement is #1 right now. So my answer is yes, I would have liked to have found a 2016 year model for sale still - but now, I would also have liked a later in the year 2017 model prewired for Blue Sky Solar with all of the factory fixes that have gone on this year because Oliver is filled with fast learners :) I fix everything myself and Hull #200 is mine. It was filled with problems when it came out, ours was Jason's first walk thru as service manager, and there was no office when we picked ours up, everything and everyone was being moved and in turmoil. So I've found and fixed every problem myself and this includes the drawer slides, the pick up tube in the water tank with John, running new control wiring to the inside switch for the Truma AquaGo, bad programming from the factory on the Dometic Thermostat at time of pick up, diagnosing the Truma wiring problem in the first place, changing out a bad shower faucet, installing the Micro-Air Easy Start, grinding and leveling the sewer hose compartment, diagnosing and fixing bad wiring on the Dometic fridge fan, fixing the bad ground at the 7 pin connector (still waiting for Oliver confirmation on that fix), properly caulking the bathroom, still waiting to see if my ground wire has fixed the front jack, which has had no problems since. And last but not least, replacing the broken mirrored bathroom door. Every suggestion that I have made has been followed thru and put into circulation. My trailer is great, because I fix and improve it myself. Oliver has their new office and the staff is all settled in for the most part, it's a different company now and they have their ducks in a row. Would I buy Hull #200? Now? after everything has been fixed? Yes. Just not with the ridiculously overpriced Zamp Solar because there is so many better options out there that cost a lot less, like the Blue Sky MPPT Solar System with the IPN Remote that Oliver used to sell. And I am looking at a different toilet because the Dometic 310 has no rim and let's stuff slosh and spray out of the toilet. There are much better toilet options like the Dometic 320 rimmed toilet among others and with all of that room under the Dinette, a lot larger black tank could be built and installed. Owning a trailer is the same as owning a home because there's always a new project you can find to do, and I do Love my trailer now that the above list has been taken care of, the solar is on the list and will be looked at in Quartzite. Reed

IMHO draining the chrome flex line by gravity should be sufficient, as the hose is the only external part, everything else is inside.

So regarding draining the outside shower hose. Since there are no inline shutoffs in the hot/cold pex lines that feed the ext. shower, I assume that "by draining the outside shower hose", one is just letting the chromed flex line drain by gravity and that's it? It would be nice if all those water lines in the back corner of the trailer could be drained when needed as this is probably the most vulnerable area in freezing weather. The brass backflow valves are at particular risk. I know because one of mine was busted open when we picked up our rig in late March. It had been out in the weather for a month or two before we could get out to pick it up. Luckily, the leak showed up right away during our shakedown at Fall Hollow, and was replaced. Dave

Your eyes see the beauty, yet what the camera captures is only a fraction of the reality, Lake Guntersville is one of those places. I am reminded of Mark Twain: Life on the Mississippi - There were graceful curves, reflected images, woody heights, soft distances; and over the whole scene, far and near, the dissolving lights drifted steadily, enriching it, every passing moment, with new marvels of coloring. I stood like one bewitched. I drank it in, in a speechless rapture. The world was new to me, and I had never seen anything like this at home. We arrived late Tuesday afternoon, traveling the short distance from Hohenwald where we had some service work completed. The drive into the park is full of beautiful scenic vistas of the lake and covered tree lined forested roads. The campground is located about 5 miles inside the 6,000-acre park. We checked in at the Country Store just as the staff was getting ready to close up for the day. After a quick exchange of information, we were handed a map with our lot number and on our way. The campground is made up of semi-circles starting at the lake’s edge and going back up in elevation into the trees. Most if not all lots offer a view of the lake. We later learned that a tornado in 2011 fell thousands of the trees in the campground, they have replanted many and in time the canopy will return. There are before and after picture in the Lodge that shows just how many trees they lost. We camped at D18 right on the lakefront and close to the docks. Our pad was gravel and level with plenty of room to back in. There are a few concrete pads but most are gravel. Well placed 30/50 electric, water and sewer hookup made our setup effortless. We had a stone fire pit, grill and picnic table that just beckoned to have us sit by the fire and enjoy the view. The grass grounds are well cared for and clean. The park is open year round and the staff could not have been any nicer. The Country Store offers everything you could need and anything you might have forgotten - firewood, ice, propane, fishing tackle, RV repair items and lots of drinks & snacks. The Bathhouses! Clean, modern and air-conditioned, with larger private shower stalls each with a locking door. Tons of hot water and water pressure that made showering an event you looked forward to after hiking or being out on the lake. The park has so many things to do that embrace its natural beauty. With over 30 miles of hiking trails, fishing, a golf course, boat rental, nature tours, geocaching and of course killer zip-lines through the forest canopy – there is something for everyone. Just sitting outside your Oliver and taking it all in came to the top of the list. The morning mist coming off the lake at sunrise with all the waterfowl beginning their day is otherworldly! Our Oliver Owner’s May Rally should afford us cool temperatures at night and pleasant days of discovery. We had the pleasure of meeting Sandy Tesney, Director of Sales. She is working with Coy Gayle (Our Owners Chairman) and Matt Duncan (Oliver Travel Trailers) to plan our May 2018 Rally. Sandy showed us around the Beach pavilion where our daily meet-ups for breakfast and cookout will be held. The pavilion is located just to the south of the campground entrance and a short walk from the campsites. Located right on the lake, this large covered octagon seats 250 and has great facilities for serving meals and group gatherings. In addition, we got to see the meeting rooms at the lodge where we will share a dinner and have some of our meetings. The lodge can easily host many hundreds of people and Sandy told us they hosted 23 weddings in just October alone. That fact alone, speaks to the grandeur of this place. The Lodge sits high up on a cliff above the campground and at night the lights make it look almost magical. If you are considering staying at the lodge, it is a grand retreat, with massive balconies overlooking the lake and a beautiful rustic interior. Sunset at the lodge is breathtaking and should not be missed! You can hike up to the lodge about a 40-minute trek or drive one of the two the paved roads. There is a full restaurant and bar that matches the high quality of everything about the park. Early morning or evening has the many deer come out along the roadways. We saw new fawns and large bucks, all going about their business as if we where not even there. If you have not booked your reservations to attend the 2018 Oliver Owner’s Rally, we hope our brief introduction to Lake Guntersville State Park stirs you to action. Merely call the park at (256) 571-5455 and ask for the discounted rates ($22 per night + taxes,) let reservations know you are with the Oliver Owner's Rally (Group Code 7066.) While Oliver Travel Trailers and other great vendors are sponsoring parts of our Rally, there is a $35 fee per person that we as owners pay to cover food and the park facilities. 100% of these proceeds go to the park. Many hands make light work – if you want to help make this event one to remember, volunteering is simple. With lots of small rolls that can make a major difference, contact Coy Gayle (gayleman@aol.com) like we did. We look forward to meeting all of you in this enchanting setting.

Added a new blog about some of the better rv/camping apps for hand held devices. Please feel free to fill me in on your own personal favorites - Let's add to the list :)! Thank you! http://olivertraveltrailers.com/best-apps-rving-camping-2017/

I agree John. Oilver knew what they were doing when they positioned the batteries right over the axles.

Mark, please start a new thread for this discussion since it is only vaguely on topic. The bottom line for that mod is that there is no way to access the gray tank to flush it out when it develops nasty hard deposits from “solids” floating into the gray tank, and you cannot insert a wand or dump a bag of ice into it and drive on rough roads. Don’t do it! Unless you add and use a pressurized water flush system such as in place in the black tank, then maybe it would be acceptable. In regards to having to service the poo tank every five days, that is just plain wrong - IF you keep the TP out of it, the solids will dry up quickly, decompose and the volume is reduced. If you have access to a public toilet and both use it every now and then you should easily be able to extend the service interval to a month, if not more, for two people. If boondocking, then yes definitely the service intervals will be reduced. The toilet is a COMPOSTING toilet, not a storage tank, you need to let the bacteria do their work in breaking down the contents. This means not sterilizing the poo container between servicing, and especially not dumping it out weekly!... If the tank needs jump starting, then you could add a septic tank biologic treatment. John Davies Spokane WA

Thanks for posting. I have not weighed my trailer yet but intend to, sooner or later. However I do have a 1000 pound hydraulic tongue scale and recorded similar numbers to yours, with much better accuracy, I am sure. 720 pounds with three full jerry cans on the cargo tray. (2 steel gas, 1 plastic water) 600 pounds with jerry cans empty. This is for a II loaded for travel with full fresh tank only, no generator or other extra heavy cargo. I do encourage owners towing with light duty vehicles to buy and use a tongue scale, this stuff is worth knowing. Those with HD trucks should not bother unless you tow other heavy trailers. Caution: a tongue scale does not include the weight of your hitch coupler, be sure to weigh that separately and add it to the scale value! A big WD hitch with steel bars is darned heavy! ... But some of that weight is carried by the front axle. Truck scales are not especially precise, they are good enough for commercial rigs weighing 20 tons.... Also, the type and number of batteries you have will have almost no effect on tongue weight since they are directly between the axles. Stuff loaded on the back bumper or tongue will, in a huge way. John Davies Spokane WA

Another one of their videos that we found interesting was their toilet paper test. We've been using the Charmin Ultra for years and it was a surprise to see that it took first place over the RV toilet paper as far as dissolving speed. The RV paper is a lot rougher and tends to shred when unrolling it, the Charmin however is great all the way around and we use it at home also with our septic system. In the RV, if you can separate the paper or just put it in a Ziploc and toss it, this puts the cleanout of both the Nature's Head and the standard toilet a lot farther out. We do our best to keep the TP separate and a simple Ziploc sandwich bag to toss in the garbage can afterwards works great and doesn't smell or plug up any valves or wrap around crank handles :)

We spent September touring Colorado with a short detour into Utah from Mesa Verde to visit Canyonlands NP and Arches NP at Moab, Utah. We stayed at Horsethief Campground, one of many BLM campgrounds in the area (recommended by Scubarx). With the senior discount it was $6/night. It’s open all year with 60 sites. There are no hookups, no water and no dump station. Each site was level, nice picnic table, fire ring and views. Vault toilets were clean and odor free. It’s a half mile off the highway about 5 miles from Canyonlands NP and about 12 miles from Moab and Arches NP. It’s first come first served and filled up by the time it got dark. We arrived around 1:00pm and had a good number of sites to choose from. Sites are well spaced so you’re shouting distance from your neighbors. We will definitely stay there again. Our site. You can see our neighbor, not too close Quiet site, good view, adult beverage, relaxing after a day of hiking in Canyonlands NP Mike

We were at the Bristlecone Pines campground in CA at about 8,500 ft. Got all set up late in the day and I got a campfire going. Then it started to snow. Beautiful. I sat outside in the snow and just marveled at the quiet and the beauty. Poking at the fire and moving closer to stay warm. A libation offered some distraction from the gathering cold and darkness. Liye decided to move inside. Eventually, I moved in too. But looked out the window at the orange glow and fog of snowflakes. Again, totally quiet and we were the only ones there. Miles from anywhere and anyone. The heater clicked on and off during the night and as I noticed it, I also noticed how snug we were. Snow makes the dark forest even quieter. Morning brought the chance to see how much snow we got and start a new adventure going on up to the 10,000 ft level to marvel at the 5,000 year old trees. Bristlecone Pines. One of my favorite places. Through coring and other tree ring methods we can look back 12,000 years with a recorded history. All of this from trees growing in a dolomite soil that was previously a sea bottom. Now, that ancient "sea bottom" is at 10,000 ft elevation. Such are the wonders of the Sierra Nevada Range and plate tectonics. Fun to ponder on a quiet night, camped in the snow with a warm fire crackling. The idea is to lean into it, experience it, marvel at what it is. Try to grasp the enormous amount of time that has passed to form this scene. Living trees that I can reach out and touch, that were alive when the pyramids were being built. But more than that, soil that formed as a sea bed and is now here! Without our beautiful little trailer, we could never come here and have a comfortable winter visit.

My wife and I did the Alaska trip (and much more) from Atlanta and back last year. It was a great trip but requires much planning and preparation in my opinion. We traveled with another couple who almost didn't get to go due to illness. If anyone is interested, we kept a blog of our trip to share with friends and family as we traveled and you may find some stories and/or photos to help pique your interest. The blog can be accessed at https://culpepperwaters.blogspot.com/ and the chapters are identified by the different towns/stops so you can focus on the Alaska only parts if you wish. It was a great trip and recommend it....and hopefully our next one will be in an Ollie.