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Organ Pipe Cactus National Monument is south west Arizona.

For those who are new to dry camping and wonder why folks camp without hookups let's post some pictures of places we've boondocked to give and idea of what we're talking about. This is Agguire Spring Campground outside of White Sands NP. It's a BLM campground at about 6K'. You can see WSNP about 20 miles in the distance.

Joshua Tree NP, Indian Cove campground.

This is Franklin Mountain State Park outside of El Paso. There are only 6 sites.

I'd always thought "boondocking" referred to dispersed camping - i.e. using places where it's legal to camp but not in an established campground, and campingin a campground w/o hookups was "dry camping." But I'm happy to go with the local flow here on this forum and thread - the point in this threat being places where you'll be happy you have a camper that lets you break free of hookups! Here are a few views from a sweet dispersed site on BLM land just east of Capitol Reef NP off of the Notom Road. There are SO many spots like this near CR and also the Grand Staircase Escalante NM.

This is at Two Medicine campground at Glacier NP.

This is a BLM area outside of Goblin State Park in Utah. We couldn't get a spot in the park, so went just a few miles away where there is a lot of BLM land with free dispersed camping.

This is Red Canyon campground just outside of Bryce Canyon NP. It's a FS campground.

I recently faced this exact decision with not a lot of RV camping experience, and uncertain of exactly where we will camp. We finalized our options a couple of weeks ago. We chose the Solar Pro package. My thoughts . . . I wanted to be able to camp remotely for 1-2 nights at a time with absolutely no hookups, water or sewer. If I immediately need more power than the AGM batteries can store and / or the panels can recharge, I'll get a generator. In the meantime, when I replace my AGMs in a few years, the lithium technology will be more advanced and the options will be broader. I'll know much more about my camping style and needs before I have to drop the BIG $ on lithium. Just my thoughts. Good luck.

This is Gros Ventre Campground in Grand Teton NP. We had nice fall weather for a few days before it got cold.

Quartzsite, AZ, Dome Rock. In January there is a big RV show in town followed by a Fiberglass rally at Dome Rock. BLM dispersed camping. Find a spot and camp!

Here's a shot of a "dry camp" site at one of the established campgrounds in Valley of Fire State Park in NV. It was really sweet, tucked into a very private alcove with the only sign of nearby campers around the corner being the light of their fire glowing on the red rock pillars as you see in the shot of the site. I arrived at the park early enough on a Friday to get one of the more sweet (for me at least) sites, even though the CG was already well more than half full. I'd just been in some more remote parts of UT so the busy-ness of VoF was a little startling at times though I could quickly get away from all that just by heading out on some of the great trails there, and even more so by going cross country (with GPS app and downloaded maps just in case!) across the lovely sandstone there. This site was also a lovely refuge from the LA crowds.

Anyone here ride a '74 Moto Guzzi El Dorado?

My ‘75 Norton Commando 850 Roadster that I’ve owned since 1990 is pictured below. It often pains me to drive the Land Cruiser and tow the Oliver over some of the many great motorcycle riding roads we’ve been on, especially out West. Often makes me want to trade off the Land Cruiser for a pickup so I can bring along one of the bikes. Haven’t been down the Dragon yet, but have put lots of miles on many other nice roads. Current stable. ‘75 Norton Commando, ‘75 Triumph T160 Trident, ‘74 Triumph T150 Trident, ‘69 BSA Rocket III, ‘77 Triumph Bonneville, ‘69 Triumph Trail Trophy 250.

We enjoy roads like Tail of the Dragon TN, Devil's Whip (NC80) and Diamondback (NC226A) on two & four wheels. Debbie & I riding "Tail of the Dragon": Riding the "Devil's Whip" (NC80) going up the hill on same section of road Patriot posted:

This reminds me of camping at City of Rocks, ID. Love your night shots. I just can't seem to get those . . . .

And back on dry camping at established sites, this is the middle of the South campground in Zion NP. I scored this site mid afternoon in early November two years ago. There's not much privacy there but the setting is stunning and it's super convenient to the shuttle buses that take you to the valley as well as to restaurants and other services in Springdale. I've also stayed a night in a well used dispersed camping spot twenty minutes east of Springdale which the info desk rangers there will happily tell you about. The next morning I got in a Friday before holiday weekend (memorial day, not my best timed trip to an NP ever but it was still a fantastic visit) line to score a site here in South which I used for four or five nights back in 2016. South has since been put in the reservation system I think.

We ordered the Lithium package. Last week we received a message from Oliver that they have experienced overheating problems with the internal heating system in the LifeBlue batteries. Because of this, they are installing the batteries with the internal heating disabled and are adding a heat mat for the batteries. The heat mat will have to be turned on manually, as needed, based on the internal temperature of the batteries. With this in mind, I am going to ask Oliver, if it would be prudent to insulate the battery compartment. Our Oliver is already in assembly.

The easy start makes it easier to run your ac with a generator. I think most people who live or camp in warmer climates order the easy start.

Jim, technically you are probably right. A lot of folks use "boondocking", "dry camping" and "no hookups" interchangeably. The pictures I posted are mostly campgrounds with no hookups but some are dispersed areas. I guess the idea is to show new campers the different camping possibilities outside of FHU campgrounds. Mike

Thanks for the beautiful pictures and locations. I hope this thread keeps going for as long as the forum exists. 😀

Never owned an Eldorado, but did own a brand new Moto Guzzi V65 for awhile in the 90’s. Bought it from a Honda dealer when they absorbed another Honda dealership that also carried Moto Guzzi. The new Honda dealer just wanted it gone. I heard they had a Guzzi on the floor and went in hoping for a LeMans or an SP. Salesman begged me give them an offer. I didn’t really want a 650, so I offered about 30% of what I thought it was worth, and they took it! Ran that bike for several years before selling it on consignment at the local Moto Guzzi dealer. Made ALL my money back on that one including parts, tires, insurance, and gas. It was free transportation for at least 10k miles. Rode it to a few State and National Moto Guzzi rallies. Even after I sold it I continued to be the ‘Guy on the Norton’ at the Moto Guzzi rallies. The Moto Guzzi people are a nice crowd.

Update to my post earlier. Oliver Sales got back to me this morning and confirmed that the option to get Solar Panels & Controller is limited to either (4) 6V AGM batteries upgrade or (4) 12V Wet Cell upgrade. So there is an additional cost either way, and the (4) 12V Wet Cell option is not appealing. I was also advised my warranty on any electronics could be in jeopardy if I DIY my own LiFePO4 project. Based on this, I am going with RB's suggestion and selected the Solar Pro package, my wife will be happy she has an inverter. Several years from now, when the AGM's give up, I will have learned much from all the experts on this forum and will have a better plan forward.

Cracker Barrels usually have 4 or more RV parking places behind the restaurant. Never had a problem there. Yes, we do research interstate rest stops. There is one on I-40 east of Amarillo that has 24 hours security and welcomes RVs. Same at the Atchefalaya rest stop on I-10 in Louisiana, RV slots and 24 hour security. There are others that are big enough to park overnight, most are not. I did start another thread on boondocking locations so we don't hijack this one too much. I'm sure there will lots of photos posted. Mike

We are bad planners, well not bad, we just don't. We know stop / start and where we are headed - and make it up as we go. Start looking for place to stay usually in the afternoon, if on a "lets get there" leg. That is where the apps come in - other than long term stays - that's what we do - Two months in AK - had two hard dates, with rez, and it was great. I will admit this last summer was much tougher - people left home and went to nature- boondocking made the process much easier. RB

A few thoughts - Many organized campgrounds - FS, Corps, BLM, have zero hook -ups, perhaps a water tap somewhere, and a vault toilet - not really any different then boondocking on a bluff in Dinosaur national Monument. In these instances, the Oliver - with solar, full H20, propane, and the Natures Head - we are good for a long time. And at full comfort - if at decent temps - not hot hot. Additionally, stopping in rest stops, Wally Worlds. Cracker Barrel, Sam's, or travel center's also becomes very doable in the well equipped Ollie. In all our time - never had an issue - other than road noise. There is something to be said about a nice hot shower, a stiff drink, and a comfortable bed - all in the rear parking lot of said establishments. You do not need to unhook - have an issue - just go - we rarely do anything but find a level spot when in a parking lot - off the beaten path - well ok, we do set up - few trouble makers are willing to go that far out - not a target rich environment. Perhaps a bear or some such - but to date no issue there - well once in a tent in Yellowstone... And as for locations - there are many phone apps, net sites to point you in the direction. Do a search of this forum - RB

We were camped at Palo Duro Canyon State Park for a week a few years ago. The temps were low 90s during the day for the first few days. Then, WHAM, we had 106 degrees and no breeze. We stayed inside with the AC on (fan on low) and we were quite comfortable, temperature-wise. Being cooped up with the loud AC was not fun, so we cut our time at Palo Duro and headed for cooler weather. We use the AC when needed but avoid it when possible. Mike

We found after a few weeks of camping at FHU sites and getting the hang of it we were much more open to getting outside of the traditional campground to take advantage of some really scenic locations. Plus, stopping anywhere on the road while traveling from A to B never poses electricity challenges. Shore power not needed. I don’t know how hard it would be to switch from AGMs to Lithium. My AGMs are almost 5 years old and still doing fine. I think in the next couple of years I will start paying more attention to the progress of lithium batteries. I have a Blue Sky controller, not a Zamp. Steve L (scubarx) has the same set up and just upgraded to lithium’s so I will be talking to him the next time we get together.

Ken, Nice selection, I really like old the old iron. Having been a cyclist since my early youth, the memories are plentiful. However, I sold the last of what I had a few years back - the road had gotten way to dangerous and my body was not up to the off road stuff I loved to ride. Cell phones are the biggest danger out there.... Moto Guzzi - mot many around - and not hard to identify - few people have any experience with them - I love them. Don't remember the last time I saw one on the road. By the way - if you are ever near Birmingham - any enthusiast - must take time to tour the Barber Motorsports Museum https://www.barbermuseum.org/ simply fantastic. Ken - I am envious - always wanted a BSA - esp. the M50

Jordanv...I’m in a similar situation, getting closer to build date and finalizing options. I’ve got another solar option for you to consider, originally suggested by John Davies in in a July post (link below). I’ve asked Oliver to sell me the solar panel and controller option, but just install the standard lead-acid batteries at no extra cost. No response yet, I have to trace them. If it works out, I will then swap the batteries for 2 x 100AH Battleborn, a Victron smart shunt, a Blue Seas battery cutoff switch.. My understanding is current versions of Zamp controller and PI Converter are selectable for LiFePO4. Down the road I may upgrade the controller for a Victron MPPT, and room in the battery tray for a 3rd battery if needed. I’ll sell the new lead acid batteries on Craigslist, lots of golf carts where I live. I think I’ll opt out of the inverter for now, I own a small Honda generator. AndrewK has shared a few posts with photos of his excellent install of similar setup, and several others have done likewise.

IMO, If you're unsure, go solar and agm vs lithium, and no solar. My home, my trailer, and my boat are all solar powered. Only the house is lithium. But, we live 95 per cent or better, on the sun power, 24/7/365. Whichever home or vehicle. I

When we placed our order we had never camped in an RV before. We thought we would be FHU campers. Although the solar option and 4 AGMs were an expensive option we went for it. As it turns out, we do a lot more boondocking than we thought we would. So many really scenic camping locations and National Park locations are without hookups. It’s nice to be able to go to these locations without worrying about our electrical needs. If you feel confident that you have the ability to install solar panels, solar controller, etc, then you could wait to see what your camping style will be and then go without solar or do your own solar installation if you do camping without hookups.

Thanks! 👍 Took a Miata on Tail of the Dragon a few years ago, and really enjoyed it. Had the top down and Debbie was hearing a scraping noise behind us in the curves. It was a motorcycle dragging his pegs through the curves. Later that day, Debbie said I had to install a roll bar on the Miata. Installed a Hard Dog roll bar during the next couple months on Mr. Miata. 🙂

OK - for those that have never either heard of or had the chance to "enjoy" this road, here's a map for when you are in the area. Bill

Bill, I had to blow the dust off an old photo of me at Deals Gap back in 1999. (It was not as well known as it is today population 6) I was riding my new 1999 Honda Valkyrie. This particular day I remember buying a long sleeve heavy t shirt which I recently parted with along with the leathers. The Deals Gap Store was tiny and had a few t-shirts in a card table for sale, so I bought one. Now it’s Tail of the Dragon...it attracts all kinds of moto and auto enthusiasts. Over the years grew way too crowded and just unsafe to ride and enjoy. Many have met their fate on Tail of the Dragon on her twisted turns and terms. With 40 years plus safe riding years and a rather number or large sampling of different scoots, my wife and decided to retire off two wheels in Aug of 2018. Oh what a great ride it was! The Valk...a great bike in its day. Never a moments problem. The last two scoots we owned my former R1200 BMW ADV and my bride on her Suzuki 650 Vstrom. Photo taken by “Blind Kenny” a road side photographer on route 80 aka- the Devils Whip right off the BRP.

It would be easy to add solar later, the trailer is prewired for it, but my suggestion is, if you want to get your feet wet, add an external solar port and solar controller next to it, inside under the rear dinette seat, and get a 100+ watt portable suitcase panel (without controller). Renogy makes some really nice ones. That will allow you to plug it in occasionally when you have the sun exposure, or if you are parked in shade, you can use a really long power cord to the panel and set it out in the direct sunlight. Since the controller will be at the trailer that setup will work great. Panels with onboard controllers are limited to around 15 to 20 feet cable max, due to voltage drop over the wires. https://www.truckcamperadventure.com/the-renogy-solar-suitcase/ If you later want more power, add the roof panels and keep the portable unit, it will always be useful in certain situations. John Davies Spokane WA

One time, around 1972 on a Norton Commando 750. Actually, three times, I went back to the beginning and rode it again before departing the area. Pretty neat road, and zero traffic. Another good one not too far away is TN 30, between McMinnville and Falls Creek Falls SP, (north entrance). Woohoo! Most RVs shun that route and take the more modern (bulldozed straight) alternative. Out west those kinds of twists and curves are not that unusual.They are found as side routes off new modern freeways, from the good old days. Though it is rare to find a stretch that long, they do tend to be shorter, going up and down precipitous mountains. One good detour off US 95 in the ID Panhandle is the Old White Bird Grade, it was made about 1920 and was quite a challenge for Model A’s - in the 2900 foot climb there were four water stations so drivers could pull over and top up their boiling radiators.... others are the Spiral Highway going down from the Palouse into Lewiston ID (Snake River gorge), and the Chief Joseph highway due east of Yellowstone. The latter is amazing because you have to crank the wheel hard back and forth but the speed limit is 65 mph. 😳. Corvette drivers have a great time on it. I have done these and more with “Mouse” but you need to take it really really easy, in either direction. Traffic is usually low or nonexistent. Not at all like the Dragon in these times. John Davies Spokane WA

I have a suggestion for those of you who are considering ordering the Lithium Pro package on a new Oliver. I noticed on the Oliver website photos, the battery box is not insulated, and has vent holes cut in it. These might be old photos. Since LiFePO4 batteries do not vent hazardous gasses, but have some temp restraints, the vents are a detriment to the design. I understand the LifeBlue have internal heaters built in, but no need to activate them for no reason. Perhaps Oliver have corrected this design oversight, but you might consider requesting it. It shouldn’t cost anything, it will save them the trouble of cutting vent holes and installing screens. The insulation is cheap and easy. The notion to check on this came to me when I read an earlier post by AndewK. Andrew converted to LiFePO4 and he plugged up those vent holes himself and insulated the battery compartment with the same material Oliver uses. He now has no trouble charging his batteries in sub freezing temps. That was a smart mod on his part. Perhaps the Oliver Service Dept. will sell ventless doors if requested for those that have or want to convert from AGM.

Yeah if I understand it correctly, it's all about getting past that peak startup load in the event that your power source - whatever that is - doesn't provide as many amps as the a/c wants at that peak.

Yeah I get it, and am playing along. I bring up the lexical discussion just in case anyone else has read definitions along the lines of what I'm familiar with, in hopes of helping reduce confusion. And yeah, now and then I end up next to hookups - in my camper van (from which I've removed the water tank in favor of using that under-seat storage space and instead using portable containers...) at most I'll connect to the electric post if I think my battery may not be full from driving. But for the most part those are the campgrounds I use while trying to make time from point a to point b. Most of the "destination" campgrounds I've used have no hookups - Deadhorse Point and also Snow Canyon in UT are among the relatively rare exceptions I can think of (both fantastic spots btw!).

We have never felt uncomfortable boondocking. We have several different modes of camping without hookups. The most infrequent is stopping overnight on our way somewhere. We’ve stayed at Cracker Barrel’s and interstate rest stops (some welcome overnight RV parking). Then there are remote campgrounds run by the FS, COE, BLM that have no hookups, (most in the western states) and campgrounds in National Parks and some state parks. Finally, there are dispersed camping sites where there are no designated sites, just an area where you pick out a spot and camp. We don’t boondock in areas that aren’t okay for RVs to park overnight. I will start a new thread on boondocking sites where folks can post pictures of spots where they’ve been. Mike

If you wish, I can move your post to classifieds. Sherry

Thank you! That was a fun project.

Oh my gosh, Foy!! Your work is simply gorgeous! Truly, you are a master craftsman!

Thanks for the kind words regarding my craft. I consider an Oliver the best blank canvas to create a personal space of your dreams I make countertop upgrades for the Oliver along with other organization options. My countertops are relief cut so they sit down on the cabinet not on top of it, this is a classic look of fine cabinets. I offer Mahogany, Mahogany & Maple Strips, Poplar stained grey or dark brown to match the Oliver flooring option and Walnut with or without live edge. Below is a link to my PDF catalog and some sample pictures of my craft. It I can craft something for you please reachout to me. 48ocean@gmail.com or call my cell 516-635-5656. Foybles PDF Catalog Onward, Foy Sperring Hull # 227

"Oliver's m.o. for the past two or three years has been to carefully study what owners want, have researched, implemented, are satisfied with, etc., and then do something different."

Thanks to the new narrow panel size that Zamp designed to fit Airstreams, I think you could make it work. No TV antenna, of course, like the 480W system. The trick would be to straddle the AC and MaxxFan with the narrow panels. There's just enough width between them and should be just enough length to maintain the Penguin II clearance requirements at the back of the unit. Here's how it might work. The three panels at the front are what Oliver will do for a 480W system - all I did was add the two narrow 80W panels to the rear. Worst case, they'd just need to use a low profile plumbing vent to slide the panels forward enough, or slide the AC back a bit, just to maintain the AC clearances. Add a couple Zamp 200W portable panels, and you've got yourself a 1kW mobile power station.

There’s no shame in leaving the Ollie to fend for itself for a night...

Thieves and muggers are lazy and often addicted and they stay in places they know, which is usually urban alleys. You are very safe out in a forest or beside a reservoir. You do need to worry a little about wild animals in some places. Fortunately, unlike a tent, a hard sided Ollie is very comforting when there are bears wandering around at night. This is very rare: https://www.nationalparkstraveler.org/2018/08/bears-have-prompted-glacier-national-park-restrict-rising-sun-campground-hard-sided-campers For a medical emergency or breakdown, you should have some sort of satellite communicator, either an actual sat phone (many $$$) or a small two way messaging device like this which can summon a medivac helicopter if needed: .... https://explore.garmin.com/en-US/inreach/ You can buy an annual $50,000 search and rescue policy in addition to the inReach service plan, that will pay for a rescue, cost is only $18. An inReach provides great peace of mind to both you and your family at home, since you can send unlimited pre-composed check-in messages at no charge. Part of the risk of venturing away from populated areas is that it will take longer for police or medical aid to arrive, possibly hours. There is not much you can do if you or your wife has a cardiac arrest or a stroke. That is just the way it is.... if either of you has a serious health problem you should probably not stray from urban areas. John Davies Spokane WA

Safety while remote area boondocking is not something to worry about. A thief is not going to drive miles into the wilderness in hopes of finding a lone RV to rob. If they found me in the middle of nowhere hoping to find treasures they might score enough cash to pay the gas it cost to get to me. A lot of RVer’s carry self protection. Risk/benefit ration is low for a potential thief. Medical is another issue. If you are remote, especially with no cell coverage and you have a medical event, getting help might be a challenge. Most of the boondocking areas we’ve camped had others around, not necessarily close by but not too far away. Mike