More air flow in bathroom

[Jason Foster]

12 hours ago, dewdev said:

Jason:

It look like the Oliver installed vent in the bathroom is smaller than the ones in the closet wall. What size is the bathroom vent?

That vent in mine is that same size as the heating register under the bed, which also mimics the heating register under the sink.  At first, I thought it was designed to deliver hot air, but wasn't doing a very good job of it.  It wasn't until I opened the section under the dining seat that I realized they were using the heat register as a vent.  I think Rivernerd mentioned it is 2 inches wide.

[Jason Foster]

9 hours ago, GAP said:

I cut a 4" vent from the back of the closet into the vanity in the bathroom.  In my case, also added a 4" adjustsble vent in the door which is pretty much the equivalent as the vents now added standard by Oliver.  After this mod, when the heater kicked on, I noticed that warm air from the cabin would get drawn through the closet.  No more frost and condensation on the rear wall and clothes dried much better.  Still would prop the door open if I had to dry things quickly.

Although the thought of drilling a hole through my brand-new Oliver makes me queasy, the 4" vent between the closet and the vanity makes a lot of sense.  Since the air is drawn through the closet, does it reduce the airflow in the hull or increase it?

[GAP]

15 hours ago, Jason Foster said:

Although the thought of drilling a hole through my brand-new Oliver makes me queasy, the 4" vent between the closet and the vanity makes a lot of sense.  Since the air is drawn through the closet, does it reduce the airflow in the hull or increase it?

I would guess that the flow through closet would not effect the flow through the hull unless, like in my case, you vent through the vanity as well.  With the mod I did to our closet and venting through to the vanity in the bathroom, the heater running seemed to draw some air from main cabin, into closet, through to the vanity and back into the hull.  My assumption is this effect and the circulation in the bathroom would be increased by blocking the scupper holes.  That would also have the added benefit of minimizing the cold air drawn in through those holes.  The pump running when water isn't would act as a warning that there is a leak somewhere but otherwise no obvious reason to have all those open scuppers.  An argument could be made that they offer a source of fresh air but there seems to be more than necessary.  

[topgun2]

26 minutes ago, GAP said:

but otherwise no obvious reason to have all those open scuppers. 

Well - 

Besides allowing a water leak to drain, the scupper holes allow any moisture to evaporate from within the hulls.  Primarily this moisture is the result of water vapor due to cooking and (more importantly) human/animal induced vapor due to breathing and evaporation from the skin.  The scuppers were designed as they are in order to create a Venturi effect that actually draws moisture out from between the hulls when the Ollie is being towed.

Bill

[Jason Foster]

33 minutes ago, topgun2 said:

Well - 

Besides allowing a water leak to drain, the scupper holes allow any moisture to evaporate from within the hulls.  Primarily this moisture is the result of water vapor due to cooking and (more importantly) human/animal induced vapor due to breathing and evaporation from the skin.  The scuppers were designed as they are in order to create a Venturi effect that actually draws moisture out from between the hulls when the Ollie is being towed.

Bill

 

1 hour ago, GAP said:

I would guess that the flow through closet would not effect the flow through the hull unless, like in my case, you vent through the vanity as well.  With the mod I did to our closet and venting through to the vanity in the bathroom, the heater running seemed to draw some air from main cabin, into closet, through to the vanity and back into the hull.  My assumption is this effect and the circulation in the bathroom would be increased by blocking the scupper holes.  That would also have the added benefit of minimizing the cold air drawn in through those holes.  The pump running when water isn't would act as a warning that there is a leak somewhere but otherwise no obvious reason to have all those open scuppers.  An argument could be made that they offer a source of fresh air but there seems to be more than necessary.  

I can confirm with pictures that water does indeed condense on the hull.  I was looking at the way the King Omnidirectional antenna was routed into the attic when i found this horrible leak.  After further investigation involving paper towel, a fan and a water hose, I determined it was just condensation on the hull.  I will be leaving the scupper holes open but I would sure like a one-way valve on it to reduce air infiltration.

[GAP]

18 hours ago, Jason Foster said:

 

I can confirm with pictures that water does indeed condense on the hull.  I was looking at the way the King Omnidirectional antenna was routed into the attic when i found this horrible leak.  After further investigation involving paper towel, a fan and a water hose, I determined it was just condensation on the hull.  I will be leaving the scupper holes open but I would sure like a one-way valve on it to reduce air infiltration.

You may be right.  i never actually blocked the skuppers.  My thought is that as long as there is moisture in the trailer and temperature differential on between air surfaces, condensation will happen.  I was planning on blocking the holes just for the winter in an effort to minimize all that cold air intrusion. Guessed that warm, moist air would rise (like in the atmosphere) and that I could vent through Maxair Fan.  Even mid winter, we would crack the fan cover, not turning on the fan itself unless cooking and it did wonders to cut back on condensation.  Pretty much limited to windows over beds where we were breathing.  We had reflectix inserts in all windows so would open up the ones by beds every couple of days to find a modest amount of frozen condensate.  Took no time to dry out.  I ultimately gave up on the plan as my experience with digital thermometers in vulnerable spots, proved to me that my un-winterized Oliver, even after mods, had limited cold weather use.  Some have had success down to zero with their trailers.  I accept their account but could not reproduce the experience myself even after literally month's of winter camping and careful testing.  I always found multiple spots in the hull, that had water lines run through them, that would drop to below freezing given consistent exterior temperatures in low teens or lower.  Covering some of the skuppers during the dry winter time may have really helped improve performance.

[rideandfly]

On 1/26/2024 at 2:38 PM, Jason Foster said:

I can confirm with pictures that water does indeed condense on the hull.  I was looking at the way the King Omnidirectional antenna was routed into the attic when i found this horrible leak.  After further investigation involving paper towel, a fan and a water hose, I determined it was just condensation on the hull.  I will be leaving the scupper holes open but I would sure like a one-way valve on it to reduce air infiltration.

We have two small electric de-humidifiers we use in Ollie.  Condensation will collect between the hulls where the Oliver Sign is located in the overhead storage.  Been thinking about installing a 2" vent in each removable bulkhead partitions where the Oliver sign is located along with using a small de-humidfier in that compartment to better help with condensation.

[Jason Foster]

10 hours ago, GAP said:

You may be right.  i never actually blocked the skuppers.  My thought is that as long as there is moisture in the trailer and temperature differential on between air surfaces, condensation will happen.  I was planning on blocking the holes just for the winter in an effort to minimize all that cold air intrusion. Guessed that warm, moist air would rise (like in the atmosphere) and that I could vent through Maxair Fan.  Even mid winter, we would crack the fan cover, not turning on the fan itself unless cooking and it did wonders to cut back on condensation.  Pretty much limited to windows over beds where we were breathing.  We had reflectix inserts in all windows so would open up the ones by beds every couple of days to find a modest amount of frozen condensate.  Took no time to dry out.  I ultimately gave up on the plan as my experience with digital thermometers in vulnerable spots, proved to me that my un-winterized Oliver, even after mods, had limited cold weather use.  Some have had success down to zero with their trailers.  I accept their account but could not reproduce the experience myself even after literally month's of winter camping and careful testing.  I always found multiple spots in the hull, that had water lines run through them, that would drop to below freezing given consistent exterior temperatures in low teens or lower.  Covering some of the skuppers during the dry winter time may have really helped improve performance.

I don't know why something like a rubber cover with a slit in it wouldn't work to keep air out and allow water to drip out using gravity.  That would solve the air infiltration while allowing the water to escape.  Best part is it would be cheap to do.  

[Jason Foster]

5 hours ago, rideandfly said:

We have two small electric de-humidifiers we use in Ollie.  Condensation will collect between the hulls where the Oliver Sign is located in the overhead storage.  Been thinking about installing a 2" vent in each removable bulkhead partitions where the Oliver sign is located along with using a small de-humidfier in that compartment to better help with condensation.

At the moment, I am not going to worry about the condensation.  However, it will concern me if it starts to grow mold.  So far, it dries out fairly quickly.  I wonder if it is a problem with those staying in theirs full time in the north climates.

[2008RN]

15 hours ago, GAP said:

 Guessed that warm, moist air would rise (like in the atmosphere) and that I could vent through Maxair Fan.  Even mid winter, we would crack the fan cover, not turning on the fan itself unless cooking and it did wonders to cut back on condensation. 

We have a pretty big problem with winter condensation with humidity often in the high 80s and 90s. We usually do not get below freezing much (except for last week).  We crack the bathroom fan open, and turn on the Maxair to it's lowest setting.  We also keep the heater around 68 during the day and 60 at night. We do end up wiping the inside window  a couple of times a day.

[rich.dev]

13 hours ago, Jason Foster said:

I don't know why something like a rubber cover with a slit in it wouldn't work to keep air out and allow water to drip out using gravity.  That would solve the air infiltration while allowing the water to escape.  Best part is it would be cheap to do.

Jason, I think the problem with covering them is, when you’re driving down the road these scuppers also cause a venturi effect, which actually draws air/moisture out from between the Hulls. 

[GAP]

On 1/28/2024 at 10:09 AM, rich.dev said:

Jason, I think the problem with covering them is, when you’re driving down the road these scuppers also cause a venturi effect, which actually draws air/moisture out from between the Hulls. 

That theory on the venturi effect sounds spot on.  On the flip side, my $.02 worth is that cold  (below freezing) winter air is very dry.  The heater and how water heaters should not add any moisture to air.  While we never experimented with it, pluging most of the week holes and cracking the vent with Maxair on low when cooking, may have similar results.  We always took Reflectix inserts out of windows and cracked fan  for a drying session every day or so.  The venturi may only work when in motion.  After all, in winter, most of the moisture in the rig is from breath and cooking.  

[Rivernerd]

30 minutes ago, GAP said:

The venturi may only work when in motion.

Correct. 

[dewdev]

On 1/25/2024 at 10:11 AM, Rivernerd said:

2".  I expect that is what Oliver had in stock, as it is the same size as the supply air vents.  One could easily substitute a 4" Valterra vent for even better air flow.

Mike at Oliver parts told me that they only have 4" and 3" diameter vents. The return vent in the bathroom must be 3". Did you measure yours? Does that sound correct?

[ScubaRx]

On 1/25/2024 at 7:56 AM, dewdev said:

Jason:

It look like the Oliver installed vent in the bathroom is smaller than the ones in the closet wall. What size is the bathroom vent?

In Hull #050 it is a 3” bathroom vent with the two cabin vents being 4”.

[dewdev]

15 hours ago, ScubaRx said:

In Hull #050 it is a 3” bathroom vent with the two cabin vents being 4”.

Steve:

I was referring to the return vents that OTT is now installing in the newer Ollie's. Any idea what the bathroom return air vent is on the  wall between the bathroom and the dinette.

[rich.dev]

3 hours ago, dewdev said:

Any idea what the bathroom return air vent is on the  wall between the bathroom and the dinette.

In mine it's 3"

[Mainiac]

On 1/30/2024 at 10:21 AM, Rivernerd said:

Correct. 

Wouldn't the venture principle only work if there was a source of intake air, to replace that sucked out?

[MAX Burner]

On 2/2/2024 at 4:22 PM, rich.dev said:

In mine it's 3"

I'm thinking a 4" Valterra vent between the forward dinette seat through the bathroom bulkhead near the toilet would be just as efficient, IMO.

[Jason Foster]

On 2/7/2024 at 8:12 AM, MAX Burner said:

I'm thinking a 4" Valterra vent between the forward dinette seat through the bathroom bulkhead near the toilet would be just as efficient, IMO.

I wonder if some positive air flow would improve upon the basement heating and return?

[jd1923]

On 1/25/2024 at 11:08 AM, GAP said:

I cut a 4" vent from the back of the closet into the vanity in the bathroom.

Just found this 5 months later - thank you @GAP, great idea! (Added to my furnace duct upgrade project.) 😂